12th Bavarian Infantry Regiment

[Chris Boonzaier]

Some goodies from the 12th BIR... I am still a bit in the dark with the blue straps... can anyone confirm they are from the blue Litewka?

[Bayern]

Hello, regulations said that in Peacetime with the litewka the shoulderstraps must be those of the waffenrock. in the case of the KB 12IR  red . but, the Sbs for the Mantel were blue with red piping and yellow number.

[Chris Boonzaier]

19 hours ago, Bayern said:

Hello, regulations said that in Peacetime with the litewka the shoulderstraps must be those of the waffenrock. in the case of the KB 12IR  red . but, the Sbs for the Mantel were blue with red piping and yellow number.

Hi, it is not as clear cut as that, until 1901 the Litewka had blue straps with yellow numbers, only after that did they wear regimental/waffenrock boards. The Mantel ones were blue with red piping only until 1900, then changed to Regimental straps as well.

However, the owner of these only joined in 1913, so I am not sure if these were just something he picked up, or if they were worn in some form after that date

[Bayern]

Hello Chris, Its true what you says , nothing is clear cut. and one thing is the regulation and another the practice . Once ago I read that for some reason the Feldbluse 1915 was first issued to Artillery , Train ,and even reaguard troops . 

[The Prussian]

Hi!

Blue shoulder straps with yellow numbers are correct, but I miss the red piping:

 

[Chris Boonzaier]

5 hours ago, The Prussian said:

Hi!

Blue shoulder straps with yellow numbers are correct, but I miss the red piping:

 

The Blue ones are found on page 703 of "Die Deutsche Infanterie von 1871 bis 1914" , there are some Litewka ones from the 10th Infantry regiment pictured... "Nachdem bereits 1893 der Klappkragen sowie hellblaue Schulterklappen mit Gelb Gestickter Nummer oder Manenszug"... on page 704 they show the 1901 version with the red waffenrock straps... we know that sometimes 4-5-6-7 years passed before "new Models" were actually being used/Worn so the Blue ones would not have been replaced overnight.

As far as red Piped straps on the Mantel, that was true for the 1873 mantel, but the one approved in December 1899, the new grey one, had Red waffenrock straps for the Infantry.

I am guessing the drawing is from about 1900, in a kind of "Übergangs" period?

 

[Bayern]

Hello, the drawing is of Moritz Ruhl ,Leipzig,1899

[The Prussian]

Mine is from Ruhl, 1903

[Chris Boonzaier]

That fits, the 1899 has the new mantel in grey, but still with the Old Shoulder straps, and the phasing in of new straps was probably not finished by 1903...

Which still leaves the question open... why did a man joining in 1913 have these in his group? were they wearing old stock during the war... i have to look through my Litewka photos

[Bayern]

Hello Chris , A practice very usual in armies was the continuity in service of old patterns of uniforms after a new regulation phased out it .In the Argentinian Army for example was current . until existences were used totally. or in the event of a Movilization as happened in 1978 when with the expansion in number of men into the field units reapared the old Swiss M18 steel helmets instead of the M1. In 1913 the Royal Bavarian Army was fully deployed is very possible that your man received some old uniform items 

[spolei]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Hello, here I have a nice photo from the 12th IR. There are some officers who were probably photographed after receiving awards. There are three bearers of the Bavarian. Military Medical Order can be seen. 2nd from the right is Dr. Bub. I cannot assign the other two because I have three names. Dr. Miller, Dr. Bortscheller and Dr. Ott. In the middle stands Colonel Policzka, who has received the MVO 3rd class crown swords. Can one of you assign other officers. On the far right in the back row there could be Major Sand (the man without a neck)

[Chris Boonzaier]

Fantastic! 12 BIR is a side collection of mine... the regiment I collect outside of the Alpenkorps.