A Perplexing Ribbon Bar To Discuss

[Stogieman]

Saw this bar in Germany. Don’t understand how the only Austrian decoration is an Iron Crown mitt KD. The miniature devices all look legit to me and the combination seems plausible. But my gut is giving me pause, or am I just being paranoid? Thoughts??

[VtwinVince]

Hmm, could be real, precedence is correct for post-Anschluss, but so many fakes are floating around these days.

[Claudius]

I maybe in the minority here, but I don’t like the Austrian award in the third position after the KVK w/o S. Even in the era of the post Anschluss. 
 

Also the combined devices on the first Bulgarian ribbon. They look miss matched. 
 

Lastly, hit the whole thing with a black light and look at those threads.  

[Stogieman]

Good Morning! I don’t recall seeing an Iron Crown ribbon on the ribbon bar with swords, on the full sized bar or individual piece, yes, but not on the miniature. With the KD on the ribbon bar I think is correct.

i do agree with you that the first Bulgarian ribbon looks like mismatched devices but that doesn’t bother me as much as the only Austrian award being an Iron Crown. Seems to be a rather high level award with no other one. Not my piece, it’s on German eBay. No way to check UV and I won’t be bidding as it’s not my area of interest.

I did think it worthy of discussing.

[Bernd_W]

deleted

Confused cross with crown

Edited June 19 by Bernd_W

[Stogieman]

Reposted in the Austro-Hungarian Forum, maybe they can help with my question.

[Stogieman]

Final bid for this bar was 205-Euro 

[Stogieman]

Never received a logical response to my initial question here or in the Austrian Forum. Someone wanted the bar pretty bad though!

[GdC26]

On 17/06/2024 at 15:13, Stogieman said:

Saw this bar in Germany. Don’t understand how the only Austrian decoration is an Iron Crown mitt KD. The miniature devices all look legit to me and the combination seems plausible. But my gut is giving me pause, or am I just being paranoid? Thoughts??

 

Not sure why that would be puzzling. Precedents exist (see below) and even if Herr Oberst(leutnant) or Herr Major did receive other Austrian-Hungarian Awards (which may not necessarily be the case) he might have chosen not to wear them on his ribbon bar. 

 

https://www.kuenker.de/en/archiv/stueck/57413

 

Große sächsische Feldschnalle des Oberstleutnants Ludwig Freiherrn von Müller, Kommandeur des sächsischen 1. Königs Husaren-Regiments Nr. 18, mit Bändern für 9 Auszeichnungen. 1) Sachsen: Verdienstorden; 2) Sachsen: Albrechtsorden; 3) Sachsen: Dienstauszeichnung; 4) Preußen: Roter Adler-Orden; 5) Preußen: Kronen-Orden; 6) Sachsen-Weimar: Hausorden vom Weißen Falken; 7) Sachsen-Weimar: Erinnerungsmedaille an die Goldene Hochzeit 1892; 😎 Österreich: Orden der Eisernen Krone; 9) Toskana: Militär-Verdienstorden. Auf der Rückseite Abdecktuch, an Nadel.

 

I have no views on the originality of the bar shown by you, Stogie, but the the fact that it displays the OEK3 as the only Austrian Hungarian award doesn't bother me.

 

Kind regards, 

 Sandro

Edited June 29 by GdC26

[GdC26]

On 19/06/2024 at 13:21, Stogieman said:

Good Morning! I don’t recall seeing an Iron Crown ribbon on the ribbon bar with swords, on the full sized bar or individual piece, yes, but not on the miniature. With the KD on the ribbon bar I think is correct.

i do agree with you that the first Bulgarian ribbon looks like mismatched devices but that doesn’t bother me as much as the only Austrian award being an Iron Crown. Seems to be a rather high level award with no other one. Not my piece, it’s on German eBay. No way to check UV and I won’t be bidding as it’s not my area of interest.

I did think it worthy of discussing.

Swords were reserved for A-H subjects, and denoted award in the face of the enemy, and Austrian WWI era ribbon bars do sport swords if the ÖOEK3 had been awarded for service in hte face of the enemy. But the bar at hand is that of  a German (probably: Prussian) officer, as evidenced in particular by the long service ribbon. Whilst a WWI era bestowal of the OEK3 to a foreigner would sport the war decoration, it would not have been awarded without swords. So the absence of swords and the presence of a KD device do make sense.  Again, I'm not saying the bar itself is original, just that the presence of a ÖOEK3KD without swords on the bar does not disqualify it.

 

Kind regards,

 Sandro

[Stogieman]

Thanks for the help in understanding!! I see your point. Thank you!