saschaw

You think the bar's reverse might look better? Why should it?

Here the pictures, I hope someone wants to see it. It's the ugliest ribbon bar I've ever seen, made from two ribbons cut in two ... But a woman's one for sure.

The first one: you're right, we'll never know without a photo or matching big bar. A World War award is thus much more likely. Actually, I do not want to say anything about the second one as I cannot be right anyway ... A wreath on the Baden ribbon, if it's right there (and can we trust someone who puts swords on his Soutwestafrica medal's ribbon?!) can only be a Knight Cross of the Milit?r-Karl Friedrich-Verdienstorden if he's been a officer (green wreath) or the mathing Silver medal with a silver wreath, or a Small Golden Merit Medal, with a golden wreath for a NCO. But this bar is sooo weird ...

Yes, you gave the right answer to yourself. A doctor, minister, and as well a nurse could have been awarded the Iron Cross for Combattants, if they were on the front, working under enemy's fire.

To make it complete, all I can offer related to Colonies. No bar, just a little photo ... Presumably a "Feldwebel der Schutztruppe Deutsch-Ostafrika", who was awarded a Prussian Militär-Ehrenzeichen II. Klasse and a Baden Silver Merit Medal for the Madji-Madji-Aufstand 1907/1908 in German East Africa. I cannot recognize the long service award which's a private purchase medal bar hanger, might be Baden or Prussia ...

Heiko, great to see these two again. My father wanted to buy the first one when it came up, but for us, it went way to expensive. The combination of TWO very rare Baden bravery awards on one bar is just amazing. It's hard enought to find a bar with one of those ... Now the second one is kind of funny - and interresting, of course: he actually wears the same award twice: "Silberne Verdienstmedaille am Band der Milit?r-Karl Friedrich-Verdienstmedaille", but given for differant wars by different grand dukes, so they are looking differently. I have never seen a Silver Merit Medal given by Friedrich II. for Colonial service post 1908, but I guess there were as well some (say five, ten or twenty). If one of those was awarded another one in Word War I, he might have worn the SAME medal twice. Has anyone ever seen a Friedrich II. in silver on Karl Friedrich ribbon, awarded for colonial service? Rick, Heiko, Werner maybe?!

Ah thanks, now I see what he meant. I love the 1869-181 and 1881-1908 type as well, these are the most impressive ones, and not even that rare or expensive. Well, not too common of course, for 1870/71 or China/Kolonien service on Karl Friedrich ribbon ...

Wild Card, thanks a lot. Though small, this is one of the Baden bars I like best of ALL I've ever seen - and believe me, I've seen many. Love those Officer long service awards. He must have gotten it pre1871 as a military. Later those were only awarded to "Gendarmerie", whrereas Baden officers got the Prussian long service crosses.

Nice one, but ... Maybe just the wrong device on a man's bar? I guess this is much more likely, but still very rare and a nice bar. Hmm, I used to have a ribbon bar from a woman's group - the crappiest one I've ever seen. Sold it to Ebay, but to someone from the forum, if I remember correctly. Will look for my photos. That one was from Braunschweig ...

Might you be so gentle to show to whole bar? I can hardly remember to have ever seen a Baden Long Service cross ...

What the f*ck, please, is "Type I" ???

It is the 4th class of the Bavarian Military Merit Order ("Milit?r-Verdienstorden IV. Klasse mit Schwertern") ...

The Small Golden Merit Medals might have been given by rank, or as a second award of the Silver Merit medal. I'm not sure, but my father has a group of those and as well a medal bar, both with Small Golden and(!) Silver Merit medal, which indicates it was given as an award for IInd act of bravery/merit. The Z?hringer merit cross on Karl Friedrich ribbon was give by rank, only to highest NCOs and similar. 556 of these were awarded from 1915 to 1918. I've got a document dated to 9. November 1918, which is, as far as I know (Rick, do you know something that's later?) the last award day for Baden monarchy awards.

Oh pardon, didn't realize this ... Hmm, Albert Sch?pflin received the Silver Karl Friedrich Medal for the 1870/71 war in 1871, and later, in WW I as a Generalleutnant the "Kommandeurkreuz mit Stern" of the same order. I guess he was the only one to receive these both ... H. Pfeifer got as well the Silver Medal, and later, as officer, the Knight's cross - but both of them in WW I. So both got the medal and later a class of the order

If I remember correctly, 17 of these were awarded, if we do not forget the Jewish person that was erased from the list in Third Reich". A aviator as well, but I cannot remember his name at the moment. BTW, Baden's highest bravery award for NCOs and men was the "Silberne Medaille des Milit?r-Karl Friedrich-Verdienstordens". There used to be a golden medal as well from 1807-1871, but in World War I, none such was awarded.

So it is the bar from the picture, the ribbons are silk, the stitching is fine and nothing glows under blacklight. It seems to be a Godet bar, but the known Godet bars have a grey backing if they are World War Era, or a red if they are pre-war (about 1900 and so on). This one might be a very early bar from the war, from about 1915, when the small ribbon bar was introduced (this was in 1915, wasn't it?). I to myself still believe (and it might be up to believing) that the bar is genuine. Still any opinions, maybe from those, who meanwhile held it in hands? PS: Mr. Nimmergut told me that he cannot remember where the picture of the bar was taken from, but most likely from a Auction House in Munich.

Beautiful and highly interresting bar. I don't think it's a Royal's bar, more a diplomatic, scientist or artist ones. All Royal German bars I've seen by now had several jubilee medals, more than any officer can have. The classes on this bar are strange though. A IInd row bar might still be possible, maybe with five other German awards (Prussia, Bavaria and Saxony?!) in Ist row?! Might you please be so kind to show some more pictures of it, the reverse e.g.?

Hmm, but weird then, that just one is missing ... Yes, but is it sure, that all these awards were actually made on this date, or maybe some later and said to be on this date? We know this from the last day of Germans in Turkey in 1918, when maaaany Ottoman awards (most OWMs) were given by this date, but actually they were awarded later, with documents saying it was in this "last day".

Hmmm, Heiko. Some things I do actualy not like with this bar: - Roter Adler-Orden which suggest quite a long service, but no Centenar or long service cross. Still fine. - A pre-war Roter Adler-Orden and other officer's awards, but a Sachsen-Meinungen Medaille! I think there can only be the cross, if I am informed correctly. - Just a IInd Class Knight of the Albrechtsorden, though presumably (at least) Hauptmann (again the Red Eagle order). - A Crown Order IVth class with swords awarded for 1st World War? How many of those were awarded, hum? A Hohenzollern might be muuuch more likely ... I hope to be wrong and the bar to be fine, but I'm doubting it ...

As the Military Merit Medal has been removed from the bar, I think it is his war time bar, which made it impossible to be a 1918 award of the Golden Merit Medal. Might be right correct input, or might not be ... Great bar nontheless ...

The "AA" mark (not VV) means, if I remember correctly, that all part of the medal are made of the same and good metal, meaning real silver or gold. I've got the same on my Franz Joseph Officer's cross (which is gold). "VM" is Vincenz Mayer, a jeweler from Vienna. Haynau, please jump in if I am wrong ...

Love those old decorations, congratuliations to an extremely fine one. You said it is about 1850? So it has to be one of the earliest Commander Stars, they were just introduced not much before 1850 (in 1840s, if I remember correctly). Yes, pretty normal with these early pieces. Later someone came and kicked one of these rocks away, so there remain just three of them. No, seriously, I've got no idea what this means, if it should mean anything.

As our Doktor is still hanging in my room, I had another idea. Pplease correct me if I was wrong. I'd say this is more likely a Ottoman Life Saving Medal ("Tahlisiye Madalyasi") off its "fancy suspension". This made more sense than an Imtyaz without a Liyakat (Was this actually possible? It still remains unlikely, if it shold be possible). And he's a Doktor!

Great examples. Very pity you cannot show the whole star, Komthur. Is it maker marked on the reverse? May be a star from "Paar"?!

Very nice crosses you have there, but the box doesn't fit to the cross as it reads another maker as the cross does. The box is for the awarded piece, the Meybauer is presumably a private purchase. Still very nice ...