saschaw

Potentially traceable? Mhh nice, would not have thought that... one more to wait 20 years. Forgot to show the reverse. Pity the pin is broken. The bar itself is... it's plastic. :speechless:

Those two were allowed while "anything else" was banned to be worn in 1936.

Et voila... 1942/45 era foolishness.

Having yet the tiniest swords around?

I don't know much about the higher grades of MVO, but isn't the post-1905 not actually the same as the pre-1905 commander's cross? Or are there any differences? I know there are same makers that stopped pre-1905 and therefore have to be "old type", but the crosses did not change, did they? One thing regarding Künker and Autengruber: they are good and I don't think have any bad intentions (some others have, for sure), but Autengruber seems to have missed somthing about 1870 EKs: an apparently so called 9th bead fake is offered as 1900 to 1914 replacement cross... :violent:

Question about rarity is a good one. I assume as set like this, with WW1 Saxon duo plus NSDAP-DA plus KVK2X might be UNIQUE - but totally not traceable. Or might there have been more with EXACTLY this combination? What do you think?

The square marked EKs, very likely by the same maker, are believed to be from the same maker as the "CD 800" crosses. And this "CD" is said to be Carl Dillenius, Pforzheim. From his EK1 we can conclude that the "CD" mark is found on issue versions while the square amrked crosses are vaultet, private purchased ones. The same might be correct for the aviator badges. There are no "CD" aviator badges know, are they?

Some good stuff, some bad stuff, actually as almost everywhere. I would not touch this MVK3.

Wow. Stunning bar. And now I know why I have never seen another Mecklenburger with this Baden medal while one sees Prussians somewhat frequently... :whistle:

In my eyes rather OK2 than SMK.

Claudio, great bar! No problems with a ~1901 knight's cross 2nd class with swords and a WW1 4th class with crown and swords, as the latter is actually a higher award. Awarded for different wars, they had to be worn together while two MVOs for one war should not be worn together. And, the MVO was for officers and comparable civilians only. NCOs and EMs got the cross of the order. No proof handy, but you can believe this. Correct! Why should he believe what isn't true? A Bavarian who was in China or GSWA can wear a Kriegerverdienstmedaille on black/white ribbon. Where's the problem? Rick even postet HuS' comment on this. Correct! As it was not correct what you, Heiko, posted. Rick did explain it very well. Bavarians (that did not fight in 1870/71) could get it, under certain circumstances. Dito. We can agree on the bar's most lkely crap. I never claimed to be sure it were good. Ulan finally did not buy it, neither did I. Still, some things have been written here that are not correct. And this must be said to prevent babel.

Anyone... ?

This bar looked somewhat different when I saw it for the first time. NO KO4 but a - presumably misplaced - M57 WHDA3, and a Schwarzburger without swords. Does this help? Maybe it used to have something else, e.g. a WF3b or even a long service award in last place...

Thanks Rick for quoting HuS, I was too tired yesterday. =) Yes, seems so, or it was me who mis-articulatet the sentence, as Rick misunderstood it as well?! "China medal in bronze with PrKrVM on black/white ribbon is fine, on a Bavarian's bar" I did not claim - or at least did not want to claim - that any German soldier got a KrVM for any colonial campaign! Your English's better than mine, did I claim this by mistake? If so, my apologize for this. I wanted to say, and hope we can agree at least in this point: A Bavarian soldier who fought in the colonies might have gotten a Prussian (not Reichs!) Kriegerverdienstmedaille... afterwards! And then, according to Wilhelm II.'s 1888 decree, to be worn on black and white ribbon, while any other non-Prussian EM/NCO would have worn it on white and black ribbon. However, either would be a peace time award... Peace and agreement? :cheeky:

No, Mr. Steinmeier had a campaign appearance. Noone said this. Re-read my postinmg, and then, PLEASE get an Hessenthal und Schreiber, and READ it. The bar might be crap (and I didn't buy it, in the end), but the issue with the Kriegerverdienstmedaille is NONE. Ulan is in this pretty right, while some experts are NOT and scream around here. Sad to see something like this on GMIC.

Tyrol medal had a much different ribbon. All fine about this bar, only the last decoration is a non-matching replacement. TrD25 would fit best here.

Gentlemen, couldn't you wait for me? Had to work and see our federal chancelour in spe today... sorry for the delay! I'm not sure with the bar itself - might be new or old but still nice silk ribbons - but don't see that much problemes with the combination. There were some Bavarians that wore the EK2 in first place before 1936. Combination seems otherwise to be actually fine. Am not totally sure about the Württemberg and Austrian bravery medals to "foreign" EMs and NCOs. Really impossible?! Wrong ribbon on MVO is odd but not unheard of. Know as well groups that have Beamten and fighter ribbon on different medal bars while they were to the same... period mistakes! China medal in bronze with PrKrVM on black/white ribbon is fine, on a Bavarian's bar.

I do not agree, and Ulan did outbid me... Ulan, welcome to GMIC, and as Heiko said: please start a new thread for this medal bar. Thank you.

NOT A BADEN Oberst but a Prussian Oberst in a Baden unit: He wears a Prussian 1866 cross. Sorry, don't have the Regimentsgeschichte handy... he should be commander of LGR 109, right?

Last one is Max Bliesener, 1864-1931, 1914 Oberst FußAR 16, GM a.D. ArtKdr 43. (has been identified by Daniel after being shown on a German forum )

Interresting frack bar. From the averse I would have guessed #1 had to be a mis-ribboned HOH3X... But from the reverse, I'd rather say this is a modern fake bar. :unsure:

Thanks again for your work and this interresting thread! Sure, it's the Königgrätz issue... wonder if this matches Kuhlmay. Hmm why? The here listed awards give a full match. RumK3 is a neck badge and his RAO3S later has gone to neck as RAO2E. Maybe someone (Daniel???) has a picture of him with medal bar?

General der Kavallerie a. D. Gustav von Kuhlmay (1845-1919) in 1870/71 was a Prem.-Lieut. Georg Louis Gustav Kuhlmay in "Westpreuß. Ulan.=Rgt. 1 and Adjut. b. d. 10. Inf-Division." while later Generalleutnant Theremin was a Hauptmann im Magdeburg. Feld=Art.=Rgt. Nr. 4. Could someone please check if the battle clasps might match to one of these two?

Interresting curious and CUTE group. I'm not sure about it, but the "1870/71" ribbon looks rather like a 1934 honour cross ribbon to me - due to the lack of a 1897 medal any 1870/71 veteran had by 1912/13... Odd combination.

Have you ever slaughtered a GODET bar... ? Oops sorry, misread the MMV1 amung all those grand crosses as... well, as something else. Definitely not Schlieffen's. He had some more clasps on his 1870 and wore a China medal in steel on a picture I could find (well okay, he did not wear this one in 1897). By the way, on the mentioned picture he wore Prussian only, leaving out his "foreign" stuff. Those guys are making things difficult. Me too, but I hope there is anyone reading this thread who is not. Might someone check this, please? Indeed it is. Thanks again, hope you were succesfull.