JimZ

Thanks Harvey. This is what I love about the quiz. Thanks to your question I am now a touch more familiar with someting I may have only glanced at previously many years back when I bought the book!! The score is now as follows: SCORE 1 point - Hauptmann (Dan) 1 point - Harvey 1 point - JimZ Will prepare my next question shortly. Jim :cheers:

And the reverse.... note the construction. Regards, Jim :cheers:

From the same publication above, here is the obverse of award #20

This is what I thought initially to be a mining or agricultaral badge. However, the book, compass and set square indicate that this award must be more than just that, and perhaps, a general labour award - with no apparant military connotations. The text is distinctly Georgian and I'd say that placed on the backdrop of a red banner probably reads "Proletariat of the World Unite" This in my mind makes it an Order of the Red Banner. Georgian language + Order of the red banner + labour = Order of the Red banner of Labour of the Gerogian Republic. I hit my Orders of the Soviet Republic book and there it was. Some background = First awarded in 1928 to the 21 Independent Engineer Battallion of the Red Banner Caucasian Army. This version of the award is an exceedingly rare award as in 1931, the design was altered. The reason for this was that the overall shape made it uncomfortable for daily wear (and I wold also add that the reverse had lots of protruding pins used to hold the medal together that this surely snagged a few cardigans!!) 4 specimens of the 1928 variation of the Order of Red Banner of Labour are known to exist in the museums of CIS countries as well as private collections and only 10 specimens of the 1931 variation. Unconfirmed information of only 184 awards of this order - Source: Orders of the Soviet Republic - Kutzenko & Smirov

Glory 429673 falls between observed awards: 422,350 award citation 11.3.45 and 430,199 award citation 5.7.45 (EOW ranges)so that would PROBABLY place it in that range. However, over the range 450,xxx through 463,xxx there are also a number of 1944 awards. Awards were sent out to various fronts en masse and fronts with more awards sometimes used up their glories faster than others. Hence the discrepancies. However, based on this, I'd place my money on this being a March - June 1945 award. Glory 665,279 falls between observed awards: 630,091 award citation 30.1.44 and 666,088 award citation (?).3.45. (EOW ranges) The 600 range still seems to belong to the 1945 range although there are some observed 1947 awards in the higher half of the 65x,xxx range. This again makes me unsure whether its an actual 1945 award or an award issued post WW2 for 1944 or 1945 acts. Corroborating the EOW ranges with Rick's ranges, 422,350 falls in range 401,524 award citation 4/6/45 and 465,746 award citation ?/06/45 whilst 630,091 falls close to 641,096 = 12/2/45. This more or less supports the EOW ranges and does not really indicate either way if this is a 1945 award proper or a later award. But if I really had to place a date on it, I'd probably say it also a 1945 award. Hope this helps!!! As for the Eur40 price, I'd give you an immediate 25% return on your investment any time to take them off you Which bank gives you such a return on you investment!! And still at that price they'd be a steal! Good buy, but remember ...its not enough. Research them and tell us their story! Jim :cheers:

Looking forward to it Harvey! Jim :cheers:

Their price shot up over the last few years. Regrettably the same happened to all Soviet ODMs, pricing many collectors out of the hobby. Flea markets are a good place to find such items at slighlty better prices than you'd otherwise find online or through dealers. Of course, with the internet being accessible to one and all, bargains are becoming harder to find. Glories as well as bravery medals tell some great stories about real front line soldiers who's often, very heroic feats, contributed to winning the war!!

Hi Prosper, Two lovely and researchable Glory 3s. I would say that: 429673 is probably an early 1945 award; 665279 falls in an observed range that which could either be 1945 or a postwar issue (catch up award). I'll check the ranges out properly with my books when I get home (unless someone can do so before). What's the going rate for Glory 3s at the Paris flea market these days? Jim :cheers:

To not expect things like this to happen is, in my mind, expecting way too much of human nature. Put simply - those who lack integrity do sometimes make it to the top, in the same way as those of good integrity. Moreover, those of good integrity do sometimes lose it along the way as power often corrupts. Its our general expectation, or at least hope, that good should prevail over evil, as well the fact that society should reward those that really deserve it, that leads us to be shocked when the opposite happens. However, human nature will regrettably remain human nature, and this makes those of good integrity, who remain untarnished, an even smaller species.....that is not to say however that there are lots of good people around who are commendable, but whose actions are then overshadowed by the those of the rotten apples. Jim :cheers:

Agreed that Harvey got this one... Sorry Windu but the answer was incomplete. Its very interesting to see how the combined ribbons of various other Soviet Orders make up the Order of Victory ribbon. The score is now as follows: SCORE 1 point - Hauptmann (Dan) 1 point - Harvey Harvey, as you answere the last question correctly, please feel free to ask question number 3. We're waiting. (Remeber the rules - nothing too complex or obscure that is not researchable!!) Jim :cheers:

Question 2 Perhaps the Soviet Union's most complex ribbon... ...which medal or order does this ribbon represent and what do the colours in the ribbon represent? Another relatively uncomplicated question to get things going.... Good luck. Jim :cheers:

Dan has pmed me and asked me to cover the next question as he will be away for a few days....next one coming up soon.

Well Jason, Lets all look at the bright side... its still a souvenier of Germany and now, its also got a story attached to it.... jus one youmay not enjoy telling as much. Your next buy will most definitely be more informed!! We all learn from out mistakes!! Also makes you wonder why the old lady only lets foreigners into her back room. Take care! Jim :cheers:

If its nothing too long I can try to give you a hand. PM me. Jim :cheers:

And we've got our first winner - Lets get this thing going guys: The score is Hauptmann (Dan) 1 point Dan please set the next question when you have the time. Lets try to keep the questions relatively simple. Jim :cheers:

If buyer did not pay, you can open a dispute within something like 5 days and if he does not pay within a further 3 or 4 days, you can close the dispute. The fees are reversed and the buyer gets a bad tick with e-bay ....for all its worth!! At least that's how things went the last time I had an unpaid item. Jim :cheers:

My pleasure Dan. Glad to help. Half disappointed as I thought it was stuck to the bottom or side of something more interesting. Too bad you cannot have it all Jim :cheers:

To respected Alexander Kuzmich on his 60th birthday from all the colleagues at Kiev VOKU (Voennoye Obschevoiskovoe Komandnoe Uchilische) (not sure of the two letter abreviation) M.V. Frunze. 7th November 1980. What's the plaque on? Jim :cheers:

Hint to make this easier.... "On my uniform you can see a Marshall's star, two HSUs, and the Order of Victory" :whistle:

Well...on the other hand...I do not see anyone daring to complain about the alignment if this was a gift from Himmler Will be interesting to follow this thread and learn something new.....

Hi Jbott, Welcome on board. Cannot really say much about the plate as its totally out of my area, but you are very right to notice that nothing much is aligned on the front. I could only imagine that if that plate was presented to Himmler heads would have, almost quite certainly, rolled! Good luck with establishing the veracity or otherwise of this item. Kind regards Jim :cheers: