hunyadi

List has been updated. Lets try and keep the posts relavant ( I would love to discuss the items on sale at Collect Russia - and their prices on a separate thread - IE not pinnned)

Nice photos Gordon - they must have been a bit lax when you were there. It was like the gestapo coming out of the walls when I took out my camera. I got one shot off before they were yelling at me. Rick - yes there is a list of "victims" which has been assembeled from records and friends. How acurate the list is can be up to debate. The House of Terror web site would be the contact point to get that list IMO. The building underwent several changes after 1956. It is believed that the basement was several levels of prison and torture cells, but they were apparently filled in with concrete and sealed over. The basement now has representations of what the cells were like from eyewitness accounts. This includes original torture devices, beds, etc...(mostly from the city of Vac) it also includes an original air exchanger from another AVH detention/torture chamber which was used in the gurad room to aleviate the stench of human waste, sweat and blood. Perhaps the most telling portion of the museum is the recreation of a chamber of the "People's Courts". Along the outtter wall is the names and photographs of those who "served" in the Courts. Perhaps the most interesting is the fact that there were still several of those "memorialized" individuals still serving in public offcie when the museum opened. The structure is a popular rallying point for FIDESZ, the conservative / nationalistic political party. :rolleyes:

Somehow I wish I had the piles and sometimes I am glad that I dont. One a couple of occasions I have put my grubby fingers into shoe boxes filled with these, but after a few floaters I resolved to get only cased examples...

Very nice Rick - even in Hungary these things are hard to come by. I have searched in literaly "piles" of uncased 1959 issues in search of the elusive 1969 issue. Santa must have had some elves working over-time to find this little gem. As rare as these are I would estimate a production run of about 10K with many disapearing after the "change of government"

Jus the other day I was digging through my documents and found that I have a document for one of these.... now if I can only remember which folder it was in.... :speechless:

.... and just about every sports medal from the time of the Hungarian People's Republic. There were a myriad of medals that were hung on this ribbon.

Great......

:banger:

Gordon - Its not a rivet at all, but a raised section like Zsolts example where the crest is attached to - above the red enamel. There are some "crimps" to this raised section wich may be a variant or a process change. According to the "Magyar Nephasereg Jelvenyei 1945-1970" (Where you got the hand drawing of the badge #111 in my issue) The article states that the badge was instituted in 1954. It mentions that the badge was no longer awarded after 1957. From what many have informed me (reputable chaps at the coin show) this badge exists. I secured me example from the "old man", so you can judge from there I guess... in reality I would much rather have a 1949 version for my book.... if anyone out there wants to send me a good scan of one that I could use..... :rolleyes:

This is the 1957 version: It would be easy enough to knock off the 1957 crest and drill a hole through enamel or even metal to get the same desired affect. With a high speed drill and drill bit I can cut a hole through enamel or glass if I am careful enough...

Drill Press + Desire for Financial Gain = Faked Badge. In reality its not that hard to drill out the 1957 Crest with a drill press and some patience and not damage the badge. Its also equally easy to push out the crest on a pre 56' order or medal and replace it. What is perhaps more tragic is that the 1957 version is perhaps more rare as they were only produced for one year before being lost in Kadarization...

Oh How Wonderful...... Any chance of getting a photo next time?

Officially - No - but I do have a photo of an AVH NCO who is wearing his Master Riflemans Badge and two of the AVH sports medals on his uniform. But I will have to wait on posting it... When I was teaching at Bolyai there was a yearly sporing event at the university in which members of the academy competed in sports. There were also more national miltiary sporting events amongst the military educational systems as well. These were your standard "sporting" events. The photo that you may be refering to is the one from the battle course wich everyome had to do twice a year at the academy. The theme while I was there was simply route out the heavy drinkers and smokers. If you fialed the battle course - you were wahsed out...

He is playing the Hudy-Gurdy....

Folks - I concur that the ribbons appear to be of newer manufacture. The thread count and loose weave of the ribbons along with the "shiny" gromets and zinc coated wire are all hallmarks of replacement ribbon. The replacement ribbons with the aluminum hardware are certainly recent manufacture, but the aluminum ones were built not with the intention to decieve - these are...unfortunatly. Still - its a nice representative pair. Lets see more!

Iver - thanks! :cheers:

Could be the 1912/13 campaing medal instead of the NCO service award?

Here is what I am talking about...

Gordon and All - In the original picture of Sz?gyi in question he is wearing the rank of Major - notice the extra "squiggly" on the interior of the tab - this is "border" for the gold tress field where his star is mounted incidcating an "upper" officer. He is wearing a pre 1939 tunic as it still retains the "standing up" collar.

Gordon - I have the book which would list it - but need to find the box it is in first.... stay tuned...

I am around - but unfortunatly I traded my grouping with the type II badge a long time ago. It was not an award that I "had to have" I guess. The one that I had I found in the trash with all the documents on "large trash day" while on the way to taking my son to Ovoda. The individual was a man who worked with Malev (Hungarian Arilines) and apparently worked in the Romanian office, thus furthering "socialist culture".

Just for others information - these are easily distinguished from the originals as the "ring" around the perimeter is wider on one side than the other. Just FYI

Cimbineus - do you have a Kivalo Dolgozo for the Interior Ministry by chance???

In Hungary the Gold Merit Cross w Crown on an original trifold ribbon would go for about $250-$300 depending on the dealer, condition, maker marks,etc... The Red Cross award would go for about $100-150 The VI service cross about $30-50 The Silver Barvery about $25-30 Mind you this is Hungary where these are pretty common so adjust value acordingly.

These are nice pieces, but they are not sanctioned by the government, meaning that government does not issue them. The Hungarain Freedom Fighters Association does - but they are officially allowed to be worn on uniforms of the armed forces (police, army, firefighters, etc...). The photo that Peter posted of the old veteran is interesitng as no one apparently informed him of where he was supposed to wear his medals and badges. I can see him saying "Nesszojabe! - I was there!"... As for the fututre of revelaing anything about these orders... Time is a precious comodity and trying to get the book ready by January of 2009 is trying enough!