JBFloyd

Entirely proper that the stars and medals were unnamed, even if it makes such groups a pain for collectors and researchers.

Thanks to both of you. We recently sold a "Medaille d'honneur p?nitentiaire des colonies" named to a Vietnamese and dated 1929. That's part of what sparked the question.

Since 1946, the French colonies in the Caribbean have had metropolitan status, so I assume that residents of those natons would receive the same awards as a resident of Paris. Prior to 1946, did any of the Caribbean colonies have their own series of awards (similar to those of the French Government in Indochina)?

I just sold a knight's badge (military division) for US$750.

I'm a little outdated on this, but I think this is possible: National Defense Service Global War on Terrorism Service Honor Graduate Ribbon Small Arms Expert Marksman Training Ribbon The GWOT may actually come after training is completed, but it's a blanket award these days. So, 5 ribbons before tech school!

I think Lukasz' ribbon was the first runner-up in the design competition! While I'm not enthusiastic about the design, it's better than many of the "Medal for Coming to Work" designs of late. The Army has had it right with the CIB for 60+ years -- use a badge with strict criteria that can be worn with pride on all uniforms. This Air Force thing will never be worn in full size, except by the Honor Guard, so why not follow the Army's lead and design a simple badge. It's time for the services to sit down and truly look at their ribbon charts and cut out the excess. That would require some unpleasant decisions to do away with some senseless awards, and open up all sorts of silly arguments ("Mine were well-earned, yours are crap!"), but we are getting to the point of folks coming out of basic training with two rows of ribbons. If everyone gets the award, it ceases to be a distinction.

Anyone know anything about "20e Bataillon Indochinois" in the World War I era? I find nothing about in my very limited sources on French colonial units. Thanks.

1963 was the year the Air Force established its own distinctive awards. Prior to that, they used the Army Good Conduct Medal. The Air Force simply added a new ribbon and renamed it. At one time, aviation cadets qualified for the Good Conduct Medal if they were in cadet status for more than a year and were then commissioned. My guess would be that this is how he qualified, but never got the paperwork done until much, much later. The order would have referred to "Lt Col (then-Aviation Cadet) Bloggs" being awarded the medal.

When this officer retired, the Air Force Commendation Medal was the most likely award, if he was to get anything. In the mid-1960s, before Vietnam heated up, the Air Force was still in the "plain blue suit" mind set, i.e., few ribbons, badges and wings. The MSM didn't come along until 1969, so there really was nothing but the AFCM to award. Since this officer was not in a comand or senior staff position, it is very unlikely that an LoM would have been considered. I've had an AFCM awarded to a colonel upon retirement where the period of service covered was 23 years. It was his only decoration after a 26-year career.

10 and 11 are the same basic award, only 11 shows an additional oak leaf. The personnel clerk got carried away, as normally service awards would only note the highest number of stars, oak leaf clusters, etc, on the DD-214 (An exception is made for unit awards with "V" device, which are listed separately from those without).

The Air Force Longevity Service Award is a ribbon-only award (4 years of service, with oak leaf clusters for additional awards).

3646 PTW = 3646th Pilot Training Wing The Good Conduct is certainly odd, since he's carrying an officer's specialty code. However, the wing may have cut orders for the Good Conduct based on long-past service where he qualified, but never got the medal.

The only collector I know of who has gotten info was a general officer who was able to get a tour of the Chancery and asked his host a direct question about a numbered piece. Not a position most of us will ever be in.

Tec Tompkins would have been a combat soldier. The 784th was one of a handful of African-American armored units that saw serious action in the latter stages of the war in Europe. With experience as a driver before the war, he would almost certainly have been a prime candidate for tanks. A book has been published titled "The 784th Tank Battalion in World War II History of an African American Armored Unit in Europe", by Joe Wilson, 2007.

The 2-volume set is a beautifully done work, compiled with the support of the Chancery of Orders. The authors are a Who's Who among medallic researchers. If they'd only gotten the insignia numbers (I suspect they asked and were told the same thing everyone else was).

The source in this case is "Royal Service", vol II, by James Risk, Henry Pownall, David Stanley and John Tamplin, published by Third Millenium Publishing in the UK in 2001. I don't find any copies listed on www.abe.com.

No insignia numbers, unfortunately. However, it does give you a leg up on using the rank lists and court handbooks in that you'll get a short list of German recipients of the MVO. The military officers could be weeded out fairly quickly with this combination of awards. The civilians would generally appear in some civil/court list, I would assume, as this would appear to belong to someone of a notable position (the stationmasters and railway traffic directors usually got lower level German awards, in my experience). A sample from Edward VII's visit to Berlin in February 1909 shows the following received the MVO: Lt Eberhard Livonius, 1st Regiment of Dragoon Guards Hubert Augustus Frederick William Kuntze, Asst Commissioner of Police Ferdinand Neumann, Clerk Comptroller to the Household George Ernest Emil Seiler, Secretary, Master of the Horse Dept Joseph Rollfing, Personal Attendant to the Emperor of Germany Reinhold Rieger, Inspector of the Castle, Berlin Hermann Brell, Electrical engineer at the Castle William Seibels, Secretary, Office of Works, Berlin Paul Adolphus Jancke, Inspector of the Royal Gardens, Berlin Rudolph Buttmann, Inspector of the Royal Gardens, Charlottenburg Philip Weigand, Superintendent of the Cellars Constantine Hoffman, Traffic Superintendent, Prussian State Railways, Berlin Gustavus Neumann, Secretary, Master of the Household Department George Richard Sennewald, Administration of the Prussian State Railways Fritz Seida, Traffic Superintendent, Prussian State Railways, Rathenow Peter Weber, Traffic Superintendent, Prussian State Railways, Herbesthal

There is a roll of honorary (i.e., non-British) members of the Royal Victorian Order in all grades, sorted by the year of award. This class of RVO was passed out to an array of recipients, from railway traffic managers to senior military officers on occasions such as Edward VII's visit to Berlin and various funerals and weddings in Germany and Britain.

I concur with Ed. Blackinton made huge numbers of marksmanship awards for ROTC and civilian rifle and pistol clubs. This appears to be an ROTC version. Each school would have had its own criteria for these awards.

I have no problem with creating display bars, but there's always the concern about what happens next. I've seen numerous "display" bars that wind up in the market as if old and attributable. Usually these are obvious and not of great concern, since they have value based on the individual pieces. But I lost count at about 8 of collectors I've met who "own" Richtofen's bar. None ever had any original paper, so their attrubution was based on the presence of the REO3 and a story passed along by the previous owner (who never seems to be around anymore). They got hosed for varying amounts of money and are unhappy campers when they discover it. The opportunity for fraud is great. I'd certainly suggest some aspect of the display bar be a key to its real age, whether new ribbons, notation on the back, whatever.

I do need to go back and update my lists based on the Morton & Eden catalog, which will now be the standard source for early Latin American awards.

Carlos, I wish there was a source on Ecuador's orders and medals, but I have never found one. I've been able to piece together a list, but I'm sure it is not complete: A. Abdon Calderon Medal of Merit. Est 22 October 1904 as Abdon Calderon Star. First class - gold Second class - silver Third class- bronze B. National Order of Merit. Est 8 October 1921 as Medalla al Merito and redesignated 2 December 1929 Five grades: Grand Cross Grand officer Commander Officer Knight C. War Cross. Est 26 October 1950. D. Military Circle Medal (Medalla Circulo Militar) E. 28th of May 1944 Services to the Republic. Est 30 June 1944 F. Armed Forces Medal (Medalla Fuerzas Armadas). Est 8 October 1921 as Seniority Medal; known as Medal for Military Service (25 August 1942-22 November 1963). Three classes: First class - gold Second class - silver Third class - bronze G. Honor and Discipline Medal. Est 28 July 1947. Three categories: Ground, Naval, and Air Force [The medal for ground forces is called the "Corporal Luis Minacho Honor and Discipline Medal.] Three classes: Gold Silver Bronze H. Condor of the Andes Order of Aeronautical Merit. Est 31 October 1958 [the phrase "Condor of the Andes" was added in 1963] Three classes: Grand cross Commander Knight I. Medal of the Chaco Peace Conference J. War Cross of Merit. K. Atahualpa Medal of Merit L. Conquerors of the Tarqui Medal for Military Merit M. Commander Moran Valverde Medal for Naval Merit N. Republic of Ecuador Medal for Merit O. Academy of War Medal P. Order of Agricultural Merit Q. Order of San Lorenzo. Six classes. R. ?Honor y Dignidad Militar? Medal

Order of Merit, knight.

A second type breast star, with fully hand-painted center. In silver, gilt and enamels. Without maker's mark.

Breast star of the Order of National Merit, 87mm. This one is gilt, silver and enamel, with the backplate of Medina of Barcelona and Madrid. An beautiful early star of this order.