Mervyn Mitton

I do think it is Georgian - brass that was originally gilt - you can see the remains. I still think for uniform, but probably an o/r's. I am a little concerned that the Crown is not sitting 'square' in the mount - may have had a repir at some time. Do follow-up with an enquiry to a museum. Mervyn

David - you are in exactly the right place to show this pair - and we would like to see a picture. The date would indicate the 'Flying Bombs' or, V1 rockets that bombarded London and he must have performed an act of Gallantry. I am sure one of our researchers will be interested in helping - I would think this makes a fairly rare pair. Mervyn

Paul - if I am right and this is a Georgian Crown, then you could be looking at the Revolutionary period. For horse harness it would be the Martingale that is in the centre of the chest and holds the harness together - this is a possibility. However, my own feelings are more towards a uniform accessory. I think your next line of enquiry must be with some of the Museums in the US, that deal with this early period. Please let us know how you get-on. Mervyn

Prove it's origins and to whom it belonged and I would say anything up to 2000 pounds............... There is a possibility that this is Military and not Police. Many Regt's. use the Castle - try looking at those that won Honours at Gibralter . Mervyn

Brian - very humerous - however ,I choose that believe that every word is true ! I know that you spelt it this way deliberately - however, I shall wake screaming in the night thinking of you marching on the castle in company with a flock of pheasants ............ Now peasants - bows, arrows and shotguns were invented for their benefit. I wish you every luck at the gun fair - and in your assault on the castle - more likely the Town Hall in Canada. Mervyn

JAMYAM. Welcome to GMIC. DavidB is no longer with us , and I agree with you that it is unlikely such a small number are the only ones in existance. Many people go for the generic badges or, don't always recognise the rarer ones. Amazing sometimes when you go through a box of old badges - how many of them could be regarded as rare simply because they were not issued in great numbers and have gone into collections - and old boxes. I think the point Chris was making that with rarer badges and medals they can often be sold for lower prices then you would expect - simply because they have not been recognised. Mervyn

A really special retirement - or senior appointment - tipstaff. Could be William 4th or, Queen Victoria - both used the angled sides. I suspect that it may be for Newcastle - also, consider Edinburgh. Mervyn

Thanks Ross - in this condition, that isn't really at all expensive. Mervyn

Ross - the text with each tipstaff would be helpful. From the appearance and style they appear to be by the same hand and both are from similar areas. Shadwell is the area to the left of the Tower of London and includes the infamous Ratcliffe Highway - my Avatar is the silver tipstaff for the Magistrate of Shadwell. They both look to be interesting styles - perhaps you can tell us a little more from the catalogue. Mervyn

Hi - Ross. You need to space these out a bit - we don't have that many truncheon collectors...... I have - in the past had several Manor truncheons - and all have had links to aristocratic families. I think this indicates that the land was part of an estate , but family members lived there. I hope you can trace it to the Churchills. The famous village in that area is Cerne Abbas - noted for two things - the giant carved into the chalk - with a big 'thingy' which tourists travel for miles to photograph - and the smallest public house in Britain. Mervyn

Ross - a Merewether Chief's ? We have tried to get away from the - 'post a picture' - if you can add any information it enhances the post and encourages interest. These old Fire helmets have become valuable collectors items and prices have risen steeply. I always regret selling a Brass Chief's pattern for the Johannesburg Fire Dept.. We never see a lot of Fire Brigade material - however, I fully agree with Brian that this is a good Forum if you have further ones to add. Meervyn

Ross - the LS&GC medal alongside - is it with the Helmet ? What was his rank and name - some of our members like to do research. Mervyn

Ross - there were seven Dragoon Guards Regts. - perhaps you could give a little more detail on this Regt's history and battles ? Also, are you able to date the pattern ? Mervyn

Paul - I would say either the front part of a dress belt plate - with the hooked part going into one of the sides. The alternative - to my mind - would be for a leather cross belt.. I'm not sure about the significance of the Crown on it's own - however, it has the more rounded shape of a Georgian Crown - 1714 - 1830, and could , therefore, date to the Napoleonic Wars. Perhaps for a 'staff' officer - although in those days more likely to be an aide. Can anyone think of a unit that used only the Crown for Insignia ? Mervyn

IG - I think an excellent topic to bring back to life. I think examples have been shown from different Countries, however it seems to be something adopted by the US Services ? A great way of inexpensively thanking someone for visiting - and a memento for them to remember you. Please continue to show new examples everyone - this has built-up quite a following. Mervyn

Whilst I agree with you that this has all the appearance of a Fraternal award - there is also the possibility that it is a WW1 Town or, City medal. These were awarded to the wounded and those invalided out. I mention this in order that all possibilities are considered. Mervyn

So much of our policing history has been lost - or, covered over by later layers of different companies. I think Ross, that you are doing a great job in helping to preserve these rare Welsh items. I hope you are thinking of a book to cover this area ? We have had that excellent research volume by the Scotsman - I can't think of his name, but he brought all of that Countries police history to the forefront. I was very sorry to hear that he had died. I - and many other members of GMIC, will look foorward to your further posts on Welsh historical items. The tipstaffs sound particularly interesting. I haven't forgotten that I put that Victorian Worcester helmet away for your collection. After the postal frenzy over Christmas , drop me an IM with your address and I will send it off. One of our members - 'Spasm' - recently showed an interesting picture of Bristol Constabulary carrying old maces - do you know anything about these ? Best wishes Mervyn

Robert - if you have a chance could you show a picture of the belt ? There is still a lot of interest in the BSAP and if you were interested in an officers' pattern dress sword, I had a lady offer one some time ago - I could see if she still wanted to sell. The shop is closed now - I have retired - all of the medals - incl.a lovely BSAP set with LS&GC are coming to City Coins Medal Auction in CapeTown in March/April. Best wishes Mervyn

The City of London have always been very prolific in their awards. They have such a long history that traditions have been built-up. When the Freedom Of the C of L is given to a VIP, then the two members who present the Casket are awarded tipstaffs to carry in processions. The fact that it is given in the name of the Lord Mayor and two of the Sheriffs makes me think that it may have been a bravery award - but, equally, it might have been for someone retiring. You have his name - contact the Museum of London - who hold most of the records. I am sure they will be able to help you - please let us know what you find out ? Mervyn

I think you will find that it is a Cravat. Forerunners of ties , they continued to be worn on semi-formal occasions - usually with a blazer. Mervyn

What a wonderful excuse to visit a scenic and vibrant Country. If we had any funds then Admin. and Mods. should be treated to a trip............................

A nice example - and excellent condition. Silver and gold were comparitevely cheap in those days and there are still many examples of sports medallions on the market. Unfortunately, they are often worth more as scrap and it is a sad fact that you do not see as many as a few years ago. Best wishes Mervyn

One of our members surely must have a WW2 pattern khaki army tie to go with this uniform. Cotton or knitted is suitable. So long as they are plain toed, any brown shoe or, boot would be suitable. Try the charity shops ? I have always found it easier to use a pair of socks of the right colour. No one ever notices and the rod that goes from the base into the foot to support the dummy is easier to go through a sock.(If you go to a Charity outlet - don't let them give you a pensioner as well. They eat too much) Mervyn

They look military - but that doesn't mean the Police couldn't have used them ? What happened to Burnley - did it become part of the West Midlands Police ? If so, then perhaps their museum could help ? I'm sure that one of our Members will be able to help. Ross - for future police posts it would be better for them to be on the Police Forum - more people with interest, will see them there. Mervyn

Ross - I was delighted to see your post - sometime since you have ....... (My sincere apologies for not replying to your email - I'm afraid I do overlook things these days - I have an excuse, 77 this week !) All of the truncheons you show are rare - and must be in limited numbers. I have seen a number of different Harbour Police formed in this way. Do you know how many men they had ? I have never heard of the Canal Company you mention - how did you identify it - is there some smaller lettering ? I had 5 or 6 different Canal Companies - all very rare - and yours is similar in appearance to the one on page 50 of my book. Yours is probably the only of the Company left ? What was the history of the Taff Valley Line - it sounds as if it may have been one of the Company lines to transport ore and coal ? All three of these would fetch high prices at a railway auction. I look forward to some extra details and we must hope you will now continue to post more of these Welsh rarities. Mervyn