My new 6 place medal bar -

[Stijn David]

Hello,

Here is one that is curently on its way towards me (thank you Christian ) and i like the combination of the 6 awards, WWI service, foreign award (Italy), freikorps and then it seems long service peridoe 1933 - 1945.

Most probably the comination is to thin to find out who was behind this salty bar?

What i was wondering on this one (and some of you wizards can give the correct answer for sure on this one i hope )

* Iron Cross 2 nd cross

* Hindenburg cross (non combatant)

* Silesia order

* Long service - 18 years

* Long service - 4 years

* order of the crown - officer grade (Italy)

Now as far as i can decipher from this:

1) we have a iron cross 2 nd. class on a combatant ribbon but then we see the Hindenburg on a non-combatant, could this be one of the ...... ?

2) What grade do we need to look at you think?, i think it was a normal soldier during WWI (or at the very end) who bumped up during the Weimar periode until WWII towards a officers rank (the Italy crown order does point in that direction)

3) Probably no way to tell iff it is a Heer or Marine bar? (as no backing present)

Im looking forward towards all the opinions,

[saschaw]

1) we have a iron cross 2 nd. class on a combatant ribbon but then we see the Hindenburg on a non-combatant, could this be one of the ...... ?

Very nice and interresting bar, but with the Silesian Eagle, I don't think he's a Homestayer who got a black and white EK ...

[Stijn David]

Hello,

Thank you, are there other possibility's to explain the presence of a non combatant Hindenburg at this bar?

I do not have it at home yet (hope real soon ), as far as i can see the medals etc ... are all but one tightly sewn towards the bar, so no switches there as far i believe?

Hoping that some other friends will join us in here

Will clean the bar up as good as it gets, as it looks now like it can get a bit of cleaning (no need to worry => as it will be cleaned gentle as the bar (- read individual medals) does deserve it. )

Cordial greetings,

[Ulsterman]

Very nice and interresting bar, but with the Silesian Eagle, I don't think he's a Homestayer who got a black and white EK ...

Why not? Many navy men who stayed loyal during the Spartikist revolts and further chaos were considered hard core men and fought with the freikorps. They never were under allied fire, but fought in Berlin etc. etc.. This could easily be, say, a navy cadet's bar who got the EK for "later service". It would tie in nicely with the Italian order too (as awarded-perhaps in 1935/43). Given the length of service he could be Reichsmarine.

What colour is the backing? I'll bet it's blue or black.

Edited October 27, 2006 by Ulsterman

[Stijn David]

Hello,

No backing present => see scan.

But iff it is more likely a Marine bar then a Heer bar, in that case mayby RIcky can see in his cristal bal to whom this did belong?

Cordial greetings,

Edited October 27, 2006 by Stijn David

[Stogieman]

Nice bar Stijn, the Honor Cross, no swords and a combattant EK2 are not that unusual. Logistical support staff, etc. often found themselves in combat situations without being considered an actual combat unit.

[Riley1965]

Stijn,

That's a GREAT looking bar!!! Be gentle with the cleaning. I would love to have one like that in my collection. Enjoy it!!!

Best,

Doc

[Stijn David]

Hi,

Thank you for the reply's.

What branch do you guys think this was ? Most probably no way to ever know for sure.

I like the fact that the Italian order is still on its place, as after 1943 i can think that quite a few of the now enemy states would be removed.

No need to worry, i will clean it gentle

Cordial greetings,

Edited October 27, 2006 by Stijn David

[Claudio]

Hi David,

I personally saw the medal bar in Gunzenhausen at Christian's stand. It is surely a very interesting combination of medals and orders. Did you notice that the Ehrenkreuz f?r Kriegsteilnehmer is marked G&S (Godet & Sohn)? Very nice.

Since I am a bit "anal" about conditions I didn't buy it. Too bad, because it looks as if it was carelessly stored away and got a lot of humidity. With a bit of more care this bar could have looked much better. But there's still some room for restauration or at least prevention of any further deterioration.

Ciao,

Claudio

[Guest Rick Research]

I think in this case Jeff's got it exactly right--

a young naval F?hnrich type with no action WW1, with a "de jure" EK2 for Silesia in 1919 from one of the Marine Brigades. The Italian Crown Order-Officer for a ship visit in the late 1930s as a Korvettenkapit?n.

I also agree... damp and poor storage-- and somebody pulled off the moldy cloth backing...

thereby denying us the certainty of knowing whether it really WAS a navy backing or not.

Stijn: there is NO way to identify this officer because the ONLY award that would have been shown was his EK2. He certainly joined before the World War ended, but no Hindenburg Cross showed because awards were last listed in the 1932 edition.

So as far as "identity" goes, he is ANY officer who joined 1915-18 (and most likely 1917-18) with a 1914 EK2--

hopeless.

[Stijn David]

Hello,

Thank you for the reply's, even iff this one will always hide his former owner (some mystery is always fun ) => it is a nice combo + i hope that carefull restoring it will remove the dirt and rust that has accumulated over the years on this one and that it will give a bit of the former beauty back.

I did notice that there was a maker mark on the Hindenburg, however did not recognize it untill you did tel me the Godet part, indeed nice

Is the Italian crown order a much found award towards German officers? Can easely imagine that since diplmoatic relations between the 2 countrys during +/- 1925 and 1943 would have been the chance to earn a nice enameled one. Are there actual awarded numbers known (for example towards foreigners = in this case: German) of that one or is that a still undiscovered field ?

Will post it once it has arrived + thank you all for the comments

Cordial greetings

[saschaw]

Claudio said:

Did you notice that the Ehrenkreuz für Kriegsteilnehmer is marked G&S (Godet & Sohn)? Very nice.

Isn't it actually like

 

"G&S" = Glaser und Sohn (or Söhne?) and

"GuS" = Godet und Sohn (or Söhne?) ?!?

 

 

Edited April 24, 2023 by saschaw

[saschaw]

saschaw said:

Isn't it actually like

 

"G&S" = Glaser und Sohn (or Söhne?) and

"GuS" = Godet und Sohn (or Söhne?) ?!?

 

Well, I looked it up and my source says it's been the other way around than I wrote, so Claudio was very right. My apologizes.

Edited April 24, 2023 by saschaw

[Chris Boonzaier]

Could be many things.... I have a couple of groups with non com HKs and a regular EK2. Many were given for service in the field.

Off the top of my head, one group to a Radia operater at a higher HQ way behind the lines in Belgium.

No Combat as such, EK service in the field, non combat HK.

Any number of guys on the major railways, etc. etc.

[Stijn David]

Hello,

The bar did reach its new resting place

Here is a scan of it after a first gentle brusch

More to follow,

[Stijn David]

And a bit more ...

I did find out already that the Silesian eagle is a Meybauer piece.

Here is a scan of it.

Cordial greetings,