DDR DDR ribbon bar question

[Hauptmann]

Hi all,

Here's is my extremely humble contribution... all I have save all the singles with the various awards in my DDR collection:

Also I've found this site to be very helpful:

http://www.medals.lava.pl/de/ddr.htm

Great thread! Hoping it goes for quite some time.

Dan

[Lukasz Gaszewski]

ehrentitle, do you know why the DDR used to make the ribbon bars from paper?? only they used this material or all the Eastern Block countries too??

the ribbon bar front cover is plastic?

Besides DDR, plastic/paper ribbon bars were used in Bulgaria, Hungary and USSR from which this system descended. I am not sure about Romania - I don't remember to have seen any. This method was never used in Czechoslovakia and Poland where only cloth ribbons (without plastic cover) were in use. They were sewn onto black cloth, following the French pattern.

[Ed_Haynes]

And in Mongolia as well (to let you get your minds out of Europe ).

See: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=6241

[Lukasz Gaszewski]

With Hungarian bars the story was quite funny as the ribbons were (just lke today) 40 mm wide, folded in a triangle, following the Austrian pattern. However when worn as ribbon bars the width was reduced to 24-25 mm, to go with the Soviet style. A similar situation took place in Romania. In 1960s Soviet-styled pentagonally folded ribbons, 24 mm of width were replaced by straight ones, 35 mm wide. Yet ribbon bars continued to be 24 mm wide until the end of the regime.

[Gordon Craig]

Humberto,

Here is the ribbon bar I mentioned earlier with the painted Russian Brotherhood In Arms ribbon. I have only posted pictures of thje one bar as the bars are indentical. They came with two Generalmajor's uniform's that belonged to the same person.

Regards,

Gordon

Edited January 16, 2007 by Gordon Craig

[Humberto Corado]

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_01_2007/post-1609-1168981532.jpgHumberto,

Here is the ribbon bar I mentioned earlier with the painted Russian Brotherhood In Arms ribbon. I have only posted pictures of thje one bar as the bars are indentical. They came with two Generalmajor's uniform's that belonged to the same person.

Regards,

Gordon

Thank you very much Gordon! is a very nice bar!! the hand painted ribbon looks very nice compared with the printed ones.

I am still wondering if there is any thing that helps to recongize a paper ribbon that could be a modern print ( fake) and an original one like you post in a realy good condition??? I am not talking about paper ribbons put together, I mean about modern print paper ribbon vrs. an original one.

I hope I explain myself clearly

Edited January 17, 2007 by Humberto Corado

[Gordon Craig]

Humberto,

You ask a very good question. With all the printed sheets of paper ribbons that started showing up on the forums last year no doubt someone is printing them again. I have never bothered to collect any paper ribbons out of their holders nor studied the printed shets before they were cut up so I do not really know. I am sure there is someone in the collecting community that knows and perhaps we will find out some day.

Regards,

Gordon

[Humberto Corado]

Humberto,

You ask a very good question. With all the printed sheets of paper ribbons that started showing up on the forums last year no doubt someone is printing them again. I have never bothered to collect any paper ribbons out of their holders nor studied the printed shets before they were cut up so I do not really know. I am sure there is someone in the collecting community that knows and perhaps we will find out some day.

Regards,

Gordon

Thank you very much Gordon for your kind help!!!!!

[KGS]

Thank you very much Gordon for your kind help!!!!!

Year or so ago, I bought a large Stasi ribbon bar on ebay.de which I the time I thought to be a excellent price. Only to find out the ribbons were photo copies. At first glance they look real, closer look and well hmmm they didn't look right at all. Taking the ribbons out, I noticed the paper was very thin. With no impressions showing on the back sides.

Photo a a few fake ribbons I have found:

[KGS]

Year or so ago, I bought a large Stasi ribbon bar on ebay.de which I the time I thought to be a excellent price. Only to find out the ribbons were photo copies. At first glance they look real, closer look and well hmmm they didn't look right at all. Taking the ribbons out, I noticed the paper was very thin. With no impressions showing on the back sides.

Photo a a few fake ribbons I have found:

High res photo for better detail.

2 fake and 1 real

[KGS]

Any idea what the yellow/orange ribbon is? Top row 2nd from the right.

Edited January 19, 2007 by KGS

[Hauptmann]

Any idea what the yellow/orange ribbon is? Top row 2nd from the right.

It seems to have the color of the Life Saving Medal but that looks like this:

Medaille f?r ausgezeichnete Leistungen (Medal for Outstanding Service) (1951

From Orders and Decorations of East Germany (German Democratic Republic), 1949-1990

http://www.medals.lava.pl/de/ddr.htm

Seems to have a clasp or graphic of one at least that runs across the bar whereas the one on your's is plain. I wonder if Rick might know as he's the guru of ribbons. Someone put up the bat signal!

Dan

[KGS]

I never could find a exact match for it. These ribbons are comming out of Germany.

[Humberto Corado]

High res photo for better detail.

2 fake and 1 real

Hello KGS,

thanks for showing us this fakes! they are of very low printed quality! any chance to see the reverse of the fake and original ones??? I have never seen one paper ribbon in real yet so I am wondering what do you mean with impressions showing on the back sides???

thanks!

[Hauptmann]

I never could find a exact match for it. These ribbons are comming out of Germany.

Hi Kirk,

I'll continue to keep my eye out for it as it's definitely an easy one to remember. If I find it I'll let you know.

Dan

[KGS]

Hello KGS,

thanks for showing us this fakes! they are of very low printed quality! any chance to see the reverse of the fake and original ones??? I have never seen one paper ribbon in real yet so I am wondering what do you mean with impressions showing on the back sides???

thanks!

The scan of the backside wouldn't turn out correctly. When the fakes are mounted in the bar, they are very hard to tell without a very close look.

The impressions are lines if the pressing of the design, they can be seen and felt.

Kirk

[Humberto Corado]

The scan of the backside wouldn't turn out correctly. When the fakes are mounted in the bar, they are very hard to tell without a very close look.

The impressions are lines if the pressing of the design, they can be seen and felt.

Kirk

Thanks Kirk!

[KGS]

22 Part NVA Ribbon bar:

Note the comradeship with Bulgaria is backwards.

Edited January 20, 2007 by KGS

[KGS]

NVA 22 part backside:

[Lukasz Gaszewski]

I have always been amazed at how unorthodox DDR recipients were about the order of wearing of their medals. Although there were detailed regulations regarding precedence, the decorations were not infrequently seen in a different order, DDR medals being mixed with the medals of the other countries of the bloc. Practically the only rule was to keep the long service medals at the bottom.

Edited January 21, 2007 by Lukasz Gaszewski

[Gordon Craig]

KGS,

Just to add to Dan's post re the orange ribbon on the bar, here is a photo of the Medaille fur ausgezeichnete Leistungen showing the ribbon colour.

Regards,

Gordon

[Ed_Haynes]

Aren't these ribbon bars heavily faked? I know so many uniform collectors just have them made up just to add as color to a uniform.

How do you tell good from fake? Or can you??

[KGS]

KGS,

Just to add to Dan's post re the orange ribbon on the bar, here is a photo of the Medaille fur ausgezeichnete Leistungen showing the ribbon colour.

Regards,

Gordon

Gordon,

Which book is the photo from?

Many thanks for the ID,

Kirk

[Gordon Craig]

Ed,

There is no way of knowing if a ribbon bar has been made up or not. Original paper ribbons and metal backing plates are readily available. The only thing to do is to study ribbon bars here on the forum and on ebay until you get reasonably good at telling what ribbon goes with which service. For most NCOs and officers that is fairly simple as each service/organization usually had awards specific to them. For General Officers it is much harder as they were often awarded medals by many different organizations.

Kevin,

The photo was from Deutshce Orden und Ehrenzeichen by Nimmergut/Feder/von der Heyde. It covers medals and awards from 1871 to the present. Most are in colour and show both sides. It was published in 2006.

Regards,

Gordon

[KGS]

Ribbon ID page:

Ribbon ID