Two new groups

[Wild Card]

Gentlemen,

At the recent SOS I had the good fortune to pick up two incredibly researched groups. What makes them really special, in my opinion, is that they are belonged to two rather ordinary enlisted men rather than to officers, as we usually see.

The first, Hermann August Karl Franz Krause, was a konditor (pastry chef) assigned to Nr. 7 Company, Reserve Infantry Regiment 55. I think that it is worth noting that, along the way, he volunteered for and qualified with the flame-thrower (please, no burnt strudel jokes) and served with the Sturm Battalion of the 2nd Guard Division. He was captured in August of 1916 and released in September 1919, so all of his awards are post war:

1. Iron Cross 2nd class. Document dated 27 Feb. 1920.

2. Mecklenburg-Strelitz cross for war service ??Tapfer und Treu? . Document dated 22 July 1920.

3. Lubeck Hanseatic Cross. Document dated 20 October 1920.

4. Honor (Hindenburg) Cross. Document dated 18 January 1935.

[Wild Card]

The second is Erich Ewald Emil Heyne finished the war as an Offizierstellvertreter having served with the 2nd Bty, Feld Artillery Regiment Nr. 46, 20th Artillery Brigade, 20th Division, 10th A.K., 2nd Army.

Again, all documents, or copies are present. It is interesting to note that he was nominated for the Brunswick War Merit Cross on 30 November 1914; so, in view of the fact that that the award was founded the month before, October 23rd, he surely was one of the earliest recipients. A genuine two year front line service clasp is ?icing on the cake? - calling Konditor Krause!

I hope that you enjoy these humble groups. Best wishes,

Wild Card

[hunyadi]

The second is Erich Ewald Emil Heyne finished the war as an Offizierstellvertreter having served with the 2nd Bty, Feld Artillery Regiment Nr. 46, 20th Artillery Brigade, 20th Division, 10th A.K., 2nd Army.

Again, all documents, or copies are present. It is interesting to note that he was nominated for the Brunswick War Merit Cross on 30 November 1914; so, in view of the fact that that the award was founded the month before, October 23rd, he surely was one of the earliest recipients. A genuine two year front line service clasp is ?icing on the cake? - calling Konditor Krause!

I hope that you enjoy these humble groups. Best wishes,

Wild Card

Interested in the document for the Austrian Bravery Medal - any details to share on that one? I must say - those groups!

[Riley1965]

WOW!!! Very Nice find!!! I'm getting the Imperial "bug"

Doc

[Guest Rick Research]

Could you post the documents? I've never seen a post-war Hanseatic one and wonder whether they kept using the old stock or made new versions?

[David M]

What about all of his rewards for war service, about 5 years after the war? How did he get these? Normally a commanding officer would have to apply for him (during the war) did he apply for these himself?

Sorry for my ignorance

David

[Wild Card]

Thank you Hunyadi, of course you have managed to pick the one decoration for which we do not have an actual award document. What we do have is, as I understand it, a notation in the Militarpass which is at the bottom of the page shown below. Frankly, I can not make it out and am going by a provided translation which indicates the award on 16 November 1916.

Research indicates that from 5 November 1916 to 14 December 1916, his regiment was involved in operations in the Stryr-Stochod area as part of Armee Gruppe Linsingen and with the Austrian 4th Army; which I think would make sense with regard to this award.

I hope that this information is helpful and thanks again for asking.

Best wishes,

Wild Card

[Wild Card]

Hi Rick,

The document is a ?folded? type which measures 9? x 11?. I have cropped the scans of it so that, hopefully, the detail will come out more clearly.

First, the ?cover" page.

[Wild Card]

And the inside page.

[Wild Card]

Thank you Riley1965. Be careful though, this can become as addictive as The Soviet; but does have its advantageous points.

Best wishes,

Wild Card

[Wild Card]

What about all of his rewards for war service, about 5 years after the war? How did he get these? Normally a commanding officer would have to apply for him (during the war) did he apply for these himself?

Sorry for my ignorance

David

Hi David M,

Yes, apparently he applied for them himself and they were granted. The research, although nor referring to this point specifically, ends with the following -

?He was in a English P.O.W. camp until September 1919, then passed through Munster Transit /Camp, where he was discharged on the 19th September 1919.

He reported to the Bezirkskommando, Lubeck, & was paid 450 Marks by the Office for War & Civil Prisoners.?

That?s the best I can do; and I don?t think that your question reflects any ignorance. As far as I know, this is quite out of the ordinary, at least with regard to known documentation; but then, such areas are not my strength. Maybe some other members can shed some light on this issue.

Thanks for asking,

Wild Card

[David M]

Hi David M,

Yes, apparently he applied for them himself and they were granted. The research, although nor referring to this point specifically, ends with the following -

?He was in a English P.O.W. camp until September 1919, then passed through Munster Transit /Camp, where he was discharged on the 19th September 1919.

He reported to the Bezirkskommando, Lubeck, & was paid 450 Marks by the Office for War & Civil Prisoners.?

That?s the best I can do; and I don?t think that your question reflects any ignorance. As far as I know, this is quite out of the ordinary, at least with regard to known documentation; but then, such areas are not my strength. Maybe some other members can shed some light on this issue.

Thanks for asking,

Wild Card

Well at least I know I am not that stupid

next question: the Lubeck document states the nameslists of the LB H are kept at the local archives Any idea if they are still there and/or already published in full detail?

Maybe one of Rick R's next projects-to-be (I know, I know, somewhere in 2009 ;-)

David

Edited February 28, 2007 by David M

[joe campbell]

a real pleasure to meet wild card at the SOS!

while TR predominated, there was enough Imperial

material to make this show interesting and fun.

you've found some wonderful pieces here!

joe

[Ulsterman]

NICE group!

Austrian medals were freely awarded to german NCOs who were attached to Austrian front line units (often for no more than 3 months) in an effort to 'stiffen" austrian fighting prowess starting in late 1916.

Also, WC, do you know Bob lempke? He may have more biographical details on your man. he is a flammenwerfer/Guard members expert.

[Guest Rick Research]

Ahaa! Thanks for that! The L?beck document is exactly the same as a wartime one only with the authorizing person's name stamp changed.

Back in the early 1990s (God knows what has happened since) L?beck's Hanseatic Cross rolls WERE intact. Neal told me he was brought to a Flakturm being used for "dead" storage, and he sat there on crates still marked with the eagle-swastika (shades of the final scene in "Raiders of the Lost Ark!" ) where he copied out the aviation recipients.

[Wild Card]

a real pleasure to meet wild card at the SOS!

while TR predominated, there was enough Imperial

material to make this show interesting and fun.

you've found some wonderful pieces here!

joe

Hi Joe,

The pleasure was mine. I am sorry that our time was so short. Hopefully we can sort out some of the mysteries of Imperial German the next time. Yes, I think that the Imperial German material was not only plentiful, but top quality as well - a lot more than I could handle.

Stay well and keep up your excellent posts,

Wild Card

[Wild Card]

NICE group!

Austrian medals were freely awarded to german NCOs who were attached to Austrian front line units (often for no more than 3 months) in an effort to 'stiffen" austrian fighting prowess starting in late 1916.

Also, WC, do you know Bob lempke? He may have more biographical details on your man. he is a flammenwerfer/Guard members expert.

Thank you Ulsterman. I don?t know why, but until I started following this and the other forum, I did not realize how commonly Austrian awards were to be found in Imperial German groups.

No, I do not remember having met Bob. Is he a member of the forum? Could he contact me? I might be able to give him a few more details on my man.

Thanks again and best wishes,

Wild Card

[Wild Card]

Ahaa! Thanks for that! The L?beck document is exactly the same as a wartime one only with the authorizing person's name stamp changed.

Back in the early 1990s (God knows what has happened since) L?beck's Hanseatic Cross rolls WERE intact. Neal told me he was brought to a Flakturm being used for "dead" storage, and he sat there on crates still marked with the eagle-swastika (shades of the final scene in "Raiders of the Lost Ark!" ) where he copied out the aviation recipients.

You know Rick, after your request I was thinking that there might be a chance that these (Hamburg, Bremen and Lubeck) rolls might still exist and that someone might be able to retrieve and copy them. Any ideas?

Wild Card

[David M]

You know Rick, after your request I was thinking that there might be a chance that these (Hamburg, Bremen and Lubeck) rolls might still exist and that someone might be able to retrieve and copy them. Any ideas?

Wild Card

Well I sent the Lubeck archives an email about this, could try the other 2 as well and let you all know what I find out ( I mean, Rick is busy already is he not ;-)

David

Just let me kno what you think of this idea?

Edited March 2, 2007 by David M

[David M]

Well I sent the Lubeck archives an email about this, could try the other 2 as well and let you all know what I find out ( I mean, Rick is busy already is he not ;-)

David

Just let me kno what you think of this idea?

Although replying to myself, I just wanted to let you know I also emailed Hamburg and Bremen, will keep you posted on the answers!!

[Bernd D]

Ahaa! Thanks for that! The L?beck document is exactly the same as a wartime one only with the authorizing person's name stamp changed.

Back in the early 1990s (God knows what has happened since) L?beck's Hanseatic Cross rolls WERE intact. Neal told me he was brought to a Flakturm being used for "dead" storage, and he sat there on crates still marked with the eagle-swastika (shades of the final scene in "Raiders of the Lost Ark!" ) where he copied out the aviation recipients.

They can not get lost. I have the complete roll on mircofilm.

[David M]

They can not get lost. I have the complete roll on mircofilm.

Hi Bernd!

That's great!! Would you be able to check for the name "M?ldner" and "von M?ldner" and "M?ldner von M?lnheim" should they be there (I expect the last one, at least Louis M?ldner von M?lnheim (have a photo of his uniform and medals, maybe even his brother Georg, who served in one of the hanseatic regiments prewar) I would be really interested in the dates

Thanks

David

Edited March 2, 2007 by David M

[Ulsterman]

Thank you Ulsterman. I don?t know why, but until I started following this and the other forum, I did not realize how commonly Austrian awards were to be found in Imperial German groups.

No, I do not remember having met Bob. Is he a member of the forum? Could he contact me? I might be able to give him a few more details on my man.

Thanks again and best wishes,

Wild Card

see here:

Bob's Father was in the Freikorps and the Guard flametrooper troops and he is writing a book about his experiences.

http://forum.axishistory.com/profile.php?m...ile&u=11343

Edited March 2, 2007 by Ulsterman

[Guest Rick Research]

Welllll, since these posts, the L?beck rolls are in progress: Krause is an exact match.

And today the Strelitz rolls have miraculously arrived. Former Ersatz Reservist Krause's entry there, showing him then living in L?beck, is dated 23 July 1920, from Versorgungsamt Neustrelitz, without any unit:

What does that Urkunde look like?