kimj Posted April 3, 2007 Share Posted April 3, 2007 A new addition to the collection: Veteran of the First Cavalry Army. 1st cav. Army was THE most famous civil war unit with guys like Budenny, Voroshilov, Timoshenko, Meretskov, Zhukov etc. in its ranks. This is the veteran?s badge for me and I have been looking for a while to find one.Have anyone seen fakes of this one...?? Or am I just being paranoid....Here is one in Ed?s thread: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=6207&st=71/Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 As I understood it (from what I was told when I first bought the one that is in Ed's thread from the "picker" who got it from the family) they should all be serial numbered. I don't know if they issued them without serial number, and I don't see a serial number on yours. Any other opinions are welcome!Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belaruski Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 VERY crisp detail though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
order_of_victory Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 The patina looks and nice and even not like some of the Chemical applied patinas floating around Order of Victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimj Posted April 4, 2007 Author Share Posted April 4, 2007 There are no signs of any serial numer on it. But that only raises more questions. Why, if this is faked, would you fake something perfect and forget a basic thing like that. Ok, maybe some of the guys who make their living from producing fakes aren't that clever. But they got the rest of the reverse right.Does anybody have an example that we can compare mine with?/Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 (edited) Actually I brought Kravchenko's home today, though it remains to be seen how he got it (being born in 1920!).Obverse: Edited April 5, 2007 by Ed_Haynes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 Reverse: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 Tell me if you need hyper close-ups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimj Posted April 5, 2007 Author Share Posted April 5, 2007 (edited) It's a super nice badge Ed! I think it was seeing yours (or if it was Dave's back then) in living colour that made me want one in the first place. Did it come with any document? A closer look on the years on the reverser would be helpful. I'll try to get a better pic of mine. But it's tricky with a digital cam.Perhaps Kravchenko was the toughest one-year old around.... /Kim Edited April 5, 2007 by kimj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belaruski Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 I think anniversary badges and medals were also awarded for outstanding achievements. I thing the 20th anniversary Red Army medals for example didn't only go to civil war heroes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Close-up on dates, Kim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimj Posted April 5, 2007 Author Share Posted April 5, 2007 Thanks Ed! Are the numbers gold plated? or is it a scanner effect?And here is a close up of mine. I must say that many things looks the same. But not 100%. Manufacture difference or.... Belaruski: It makes sense that a commemorative badge also could be some sort of award. I would guess that it had been awarded for something related to 1st Cav. Army. Perhaps a flattering historic book/article would be worth a badge.../Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Not possible to say if there was originally a very light gilt there (there is a "hint" of gilding on the number "50", saber handles, and horse's head on the obverse) or is it just tarnish/scanner effect? Whatever gilding was on this badge, it didn't last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Could it be an unissued medal that KimJ has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Zulus Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Gentlemen,in my view the numbers of the years are 100 % ident, which proofs, that Kim's badge shouldn't be a fake - besides the overall qualities of Kim's badge.There are some other (rare & highpriced) badges with s/n. AND without s/n.: For example the badge to the title "Meritorious Pilot of the CCCP". I have one in my collection without s/n., but it is documented, that both versions (and two differnt versions of rv. & mintmark) do exist.Maybe Kim's badge was really unissued, as Bryan "Soviet" pointed out.I don't agree with the verdict of that guy from the "other" Soviet forum, who simply said: "It's a fake!".Best regards Christian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimj Posted April 6, 2007 Author Share Posted April 6, 2007 Thanks for the support Christian. I have looked at the numbers and I?m still finding details, some that match and some that differ slightly. One could go mad doing this. Serial numbers are missing on all badges/orders at some point in the manufacturing process. So who knows? That it?s missing isn?t hard evidence of anything, just that it?s odd.I disagree that I got a direct verdict on ?the other forum?. It was more like a nice way to say ?fake until proven real?. And it?s just an opinion./Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted April 7, 2007 Share Posted April 7, 2007 I disagree that I got a direct verdict on ?the other forum?. It was more like a nice way to say ?fake until proven real?. And it?s just an opinion.Actually, I think he was just trying to be informative with his comment of: "These ARE faked (what isn't these days?)..." I don't think he was saying that this one is a fake.Back on the topic of this badge, I started thinking that they might have made the numbered badges for officers of the unit, and perhaps gave unnumbered ones to the rest of the veterans. Oddly, the numbered badge came from the estate of someone who WASN'T even in the unit (he was too young to have been in the Civil War) but was a general officer at the time. Rather odd, I think.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 7, 2007 Share Posted April 7, 2007 And, Dave, I think if we could deduce the story there, we might know more about these anniversary badges. I love puzzles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seb16trs Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 hello gentlemen, all that I can say is that a good friend of mine has this badge with a rotative tool-engraved serial number. But, would it be possible to tell us the cotation of such a piece please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 Seb: Like mine?I tried to find the thread on That Other Forum (where I rarely go), and it seems not to be there. Managament censorship? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seb16trs Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 hello Ed, yes I was speaking of this cavalry veteran badge of very high quality... It is here in Paris. Never shown on the other big forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 Seb: Like mine?I tried to find the thread on That Other Forum (where I rarely go), and it seems not to be there. Managament censorship?No censorship that I'm aware of. -the Management from the other forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyFCO Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 Ed-The thread is still there (no reason to delete it) The link to it is: http://www.soviet-awards.com/forum/soviet-...t-cav-army.html (hope no one minds the link!)Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimj Posted April 9, 2007 Author Share Posted April 9, 2007 There seems to some missunderstanding. The link Dave posted is just my badge question "over there". So there was no "censorship" needed. The badge seb16trs is refering to is in Paris, off-line. If you could get some scans or pics seb16trs we would be happy.But, would it be possible to tell us the cotation of such a piece please?I do not know what you meant with this. How many made? or What the statues were? From some Russian collector forum I saw a guess on 1000 made. But I doubt he had any hard evidence for that.I'll try to get some more info on the high quality fakes Marc, on SAF, was writing about. But that will take some time. Stay tuned to this thread for more to come.... /Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted April 9, 2007 Share Posted April 9, 2007 Ed-The thread is still there (no reason to delete it) The link to it is: http://www.soviet-awards.com/forum/soviet-...t-cav-army.html (hope no one minds the link!)DaveOK, thanks. I couldn't find it. Obvious user error on my part. Just wanted to see what was said Over There.We do not, so far as I know, have any policy prohibiting links. We know knowledge resides all over. Unlike Other Fora. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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