Ferdinand Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 (edited) Today I bought this group, belonging to Grigory Anufriyevich Stepanovich. I was a little suspicious about it being a real 'group', because the order books are missing, the Virgin Lands doc is missing, a badge is missing and there are two 1985 issue OPW's (odd?). Still, it had a fair price so I bought it.What I found most interesting was the document for the Badge "50 years member of the CPSU", which I haven't seen before:I will submit it for research, as I'm curious what kind of man comrade Stepanovich could have been. There are no ranks on the docs. The Red Star has S/N 668889. He was an early CPSU-member, so probably not some enlisted soldier in the GPW. And was this combination of military and civilian medals common?Auke Edited June 16, 2007 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Let's see the other documents. Sometimes there are clues (not always accurate) in the serial number letters on those, and by whom the awards wewre issued.I've never seen the 50 years lapel pin document for as far back as 1919 either. Mine all date from the 1980s (1930s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Zulus Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Dear Auke,highly interesting group .Seems that your comrade hadn't been in the ranks of the Red Army, Navy or NKVD at all .I had been possible for non-army comrades during the GPW to get an RS or OPW. The confering of OPW to civilian people had been stopped after the war.My explaination for the two 1985-OPW is, that one of them might be a replacement for an OPW he got during the GPW and he lost .Best regards Christian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 It is interesting (and telling?) that all the documents are there, except the important one. Rick is right (of course): Seeing more may reveal more, for good or ill.I, too, have suspicions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerd Becker Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 I think, its not impossible, that he indeed got two 1985 OGPW?s, either accidently or maybe they over saw something, when they awarded him the 2nd class and corrected it later by giving him a 1st class. I guess, the 1985 issue OGPW?s were not seen as important enough to demand the 2nd class back. I remember, i have seen groups with two 1985er OGPW?s including their documents once or twice, so i guess, its possible, that he was awarded both classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Zulus Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 I think, its not impossible, that he indeed got two 1985 OGPW?s, either accidently or maybe they over saw something, when they awarded him the 2nd class and corrected it later by giving him a 1st class. I guess, the 1985 issue OGPW?s were not seen as important enough to demand the 2nd class back. I remember, i have seen groups with two 1985er OGPW?s including their documents once or twice, so i guess, its possible, that he was awarded both classes.Dear Gerd,your argument makes sense .Maybe the comrade had been wounded during the GPW, got first the 2cl and argued then, that he as a wounded victim of the GPW should get the 1cl .Best regards Christian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerd Becker Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 Exactly my thoughts, Christian. Gerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted June 17, 2007 Author Share Posted June 17, 2007 (edited) Here are all the docs in chronological order:12 August 1944 - Defense of Moscow:Close-up lower part, signed by the chairman and the secretary of the Executive Committee of the Moscow City Counsil:28 September 1946 - Valiant Labor in the GPW:24 December 1965 - 20 Years Victory:1 October 1968 - 50 Years Armed Forces: Edited June 17, 2007 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted June 17, 2007 Author Share Posted June 17, 2007 1969 - Badge "50 Years Member of the CPSU":3 November 1975 - 30 Years Victory:21 April 1978 - Veteran of Labor:12 February 1979 - 60 Years Armed Forces:1985 - 40 Years Victory: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 OK, well those don't help very much, other than to show that he was a lifelong (after the war) resident of Moscow.The "A" on his Defense of Moscow suggests that he was of "officer" status, though that is not foolproof. I have seen "A" paperwork to enlisted personnel. But it suggests he was important enough to have gotten a "first round" award. The WW2 Labor Victory with that suggests some sort of political/economic background, but the later Victory jubilees are for MILITARY participation in the war, not labor-- so there is a military Victory Over Germany also missing.I guess all you can do is TRY the Red Star for research and hope it is his. BUTwhat is the serial number for the Red Star? because if it is NOT a wartime number, chances are that can't be his. If it's one of the 1950s 15 years long service ones, it would be extremely unlikely in this group, from what we can see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted June 17, 2007 Author Share Posted June 17, 2007 (edited) Thanks Rick. I always wondered what the A, O, P, G, etc. meant.According to our researcher he can also research by name. So I will submit the name + the Red Star S/N for research. As I wrote in post # 1 the Red Star serial number is 668889, so probably a spring 1944 award. Here are detail pictures of the obverse and reverse.Auke Edited June 17, 2007 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 Ah-- I missed the serial number. Ask for the research by that serial number, rather than by this guy's name. If it does not match, at least you will have the Red Star citation etc rather than VERY expensive research on very CHEAP jubilee medals-- or even WORSE, very expensive research on some completely WRONG man with the same name! The award serial number letters are VERY inconsistent. They "mean" nothing whatsoever on any of the large "certificate" campaign medals before the Moscow "booklet" type, nor can I see any pattern in the Labor Victories etc.But in MILITARY awards, it seems that in MOST cases "A" = officer or first batch of awards, "B" and "V" = enlisted ranks or subsequent later awards. So it depends on the paperwork. But the statistical odds are good from that, that he was of officer status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
order_of_victory Posted June 17, 2007 Share Posted June 17, 2007 Sorry to go a bit off topic but my Ч lettered document for moscow it does not have the signaure for Moscow city council only usual on signature of the person awrding the medal Has any one else seen this type of document before with the two signatures on Order of Victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted December 4, 2007 Author Share Posted December 4, 2007 Research just came in for the Red Star. It wasn't awarded to Stepanovich, but to Senior Lieutenant of Intendant Service Nikolai Timofeyevich Shmatov. Next step: submitting Stepanovich's name for research in the hope of finding the Award Card? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Haynes Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 Ooooffffff. Sorry. But I guess this is one of the reasons we do research? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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