Paul R Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 Hello,This is the tag from my General Staff Oberst tunic. Can anyone make out anything from it? Any help is greatly appreciated!!Kind regardsPaul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 6, 2007 Author Share Posted July 6, 2007 or Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 6, 2007 Author Share Posted July 6, 2007 or even Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 Name first rank secondGEYER or GEIER (cannot tell because of the bent wrinkle) Assessor.That is, an educational official of Captain rank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 6, 2007 Author Share Posted July 6, 2007 You are good!! Thanks Rick! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lyons Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 Your cover is blown Rick, your really Sherlock Holmes in mufti!Very impressive detective work.Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 I agree!! Rick is a Godsend! The only bummer is that this label is inside of the General Staff tunic!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I agree!! Rick is a Godsend! The only bummer is that this label is inside of the General Staff tunic!!! and ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 and ???I am in the process of making arrangements for the uniform's return! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcsanche Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 (edited) Hi Paul I do not understant. Is been an educational Cpt. that the kiss of death for that tunic?. I am not sure. I do not see anything wrong with the jacket.Juan Edited July 7, 2007 by jcsanche Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 I have never heard of an official being accepted into the General Staff?? If I am missing something, please do tell me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I have never heard of an official being accepted into the General Staff?? If I am missing something, please do tell me. I believe the date on the tag could help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 The date is 15Feb1939. I do know that General Staff Officers were selected from the ranks, yet I have never thought that this included Officials. Is there a roster out there that lists the Luftwaffe General Staff Officers during the war? Nothing would please me more than this uniform being legit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 The date is 15Feb1939. I do know that General Staff Officers were selected from the ranks, yet I have never thought that this included Officials. Is there a roster out there that lists the Luftwaffe General Staff Officers during the war? Nothing would please me more than this uniform being legit!Well some points to start withthe name is not readableSomebody would be stupid enought to change (post war) both collar and shoulder boards BUT to let the tag when it is so easy just to remove it.95% of the postwar additions are with yellow pipingDon't forget that this piping is not only for Gal staff, I think (I can be wrong) that veterinarian use itif the date was 1945 I would be more sceptical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 Well 2 points to start withthe name is not readableSomebody would be stupid enought to change (post war) both collar and shoulder boards BUT to let the tag when it is so easy just to remove it.95% of the postwar additions are with yellow pipingDon't forget that this piping is not only for Gal staff, I think (I can be wrong) that veterinarian use itif the date was 1945 I would be more scepticalHi Francios,Thank you for the reply. Your cool and level headed thought process is just what I need right now! Thank you! Your points are very good areas for consideration. There was a Veterinary arm that was established in 1943, yet this was for EM's and NCO's only(per Vol3 of Angolia's Uniforms and Traditions of the Luftwaffe, in the Field Divisions Section). Veterinary Officers were loaned by the Heer and retained their Heer uniforms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Yes but people ARE stupid. They DO leave tags as evidence of their crimes. The assumption always is"If I can't read it, nobody can read it.""A name tag adds extra value--see it must be really real REAL.""Nobody can ever track any of these names anyway, so I'll get away with it."Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. For 60 years meddling monkey fingers have been "improving" tunicsperfectly good original (and in many cases far rarer As Is than the @&%ing morons realize) tunicsby upping rank, changing to more "desirable" ($ ? ? ?) branchesand generally butchering the ever dwindling supply of original UNTOUCHED uniforms.Personally, I would not be at all pleased to discover an untouched, overlooked, damning Tell All tag left in a tunic the insignia of which does not match.Because it is far more likely for the three "reasons" above to have been overlooked in the commission of deception than that some Even More Stupid Person came up with an unattached name label (anybody collecting those?) or removed a label from one tunic and put THAT in another thinking that an"unreadaable," "untraceable" tag would add to sales price.Unfortunately, what can be virtually guaranteed is that the tunic will resurface againwith a conveniently2007removed tag and THEN be "absolutely wonderful."But not, unfortunately, by my standards.And this did not even get INTO award loops or lack thereof for a full Colonel of General Staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I will add that Brick tranlated the label but didn't say it is a mess up jacketFor all, not too fast reactions, don't judge a book by its cover as several parameters have to enter in the equation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 Thank you Rick and Francois!What parameters are you referring to Francois? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Yes but people ARE stupid. They DO leave tags as evidence of their crimes. The assumption always is"If I can't read it, nobody can read it.""A name tag adds extra value--see it must be really real REAL.""Nobody can ever track any of these names anyway, so I'll get away with it."Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. For 60 years meddling monkey fingers have been "improving" tunicsperfectly good original (and in many cases far rarer As Is than the @&%ing morons realize) tunicsby upping rank, changing to more "desirable" ($ ? ? ?) branchesand generally butchering the ever dwindling supply of original UNTOUCHED uniforms.Personally, I would not be at all pleased to discover an untouched, overlooked, damning Tell All tag left in a tunic the insignia of which does not match.Because it is far more likely for the three "reasons" above to have been overlooked in the commission of deception than that some Even More Stupid Person came up with an unattached name label (anybody collecting those?) or removed a label from one tunic and put THAT in another thinking that an"unreadaable," "untraceable" tag would add to sales price.Unfortunately, what can be virtually guaranteed is that the tunic will resurface againwith a conveniently2007removed tag and THEN be "absolutely wonderful."But not, unfortunately, by my standards.And this did not even get INTO award loops or lack thereof for a full Colonel of General Staff.Tssss .... then, please, why make it pink and not yellow to sell it faster and for more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I will add that Brick tranlated the label but didn't say it is a mess up jacketFor all, not too fast reactions, don't judge a book by its cover as several parameters have to enter in the equationSorry, Vrick is now saying the tunic is probably messed post war Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François SAEZ Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Thank you Rick and Francois!What parameters are you referring to Francois?Well only few collectors will buy a carmine tunic when 20.000 would buy a yellow oneThe tag say 15Feb1939 and not 1945, the name is not identifyedI would examine the insignas, to find trace of others insignasthing is simple: you are comparing a tag dated 15Feb1939 to a tunic as it was at the end of the war - but what happened to the owner or to the tunic in beween, it seems that nobody know, do you?Many addition/transformations were done to the issued uniforms, some were use 2,3 ................ times re-used by different branches/ranks etc,etc ...... many examples are seen on those non regulation uses/modifications.The items are becoming exotic VS textbook, does that make them fake?Krick is right if you want a textbook one or when it will be the time for you to resell it (if you do) but what Drick will not admit is that many things non text book have been use during the war.But a the end of the day you are the one to take the decision, we only give you opinions based on our experiece**** Can you pm me the price, pleaseFran?ois Lundstr?m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 I would examine the insignas, to find trace of others insignas**** Can you pm me the price, pleaseFran?ois Lundstr?mThere are signs of replaced collar tabs and perhaps shoulder boards. Although, the job seems to have been completed in a very professional manner and done long ago with non glowing thread..PM sent about the price of the tunic and trousers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary B Posted July 8, 2007 Share Posted July 8, 2007 Dear Paul, Per Rick's comment; can you discuss the ribbon loops and award loops; as I recall there were some on this tunic.Gary BThere are signs of replaced collar tabs and perhaps shoulder boards. Although, the job seems to have been completed in a very professional manner and done long ago with non glowing thread..PM sent about the price of the tunic and trousers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul R Posted July 8, 2007 Author Share Posted July 8, 2007 Hi Gary,There was a set of loops for 1 badge and for a 3-4 placed ribbon bar.Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcsanche Posted July 8, 2007 Share Posted July 8, 2007 (edited) Hi Tunics, specially a dress tunic ( I think this was a dress tunic due the quality and probably stayed at the soldiers closet) outlived the owner. This was a private purchase so the family had the option to give it to a friend or relative that served also in the LW. If was an issued piece it would had been re-issued by the LW clothing depot. If the family gave this tunic to another officer I would think that officer would have removed the named label and replaced with his own name? I am sorry if is not the real deal. Paul had been waiting for few months and sold several nice untouched tunics to get this one. It would had fouled me if not for the label.regardsJuan Edited July 8, 2007 by jcsanche Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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