Soviet Major of Infantry Victory Parade uniform

[sftrooper86]

Here is my Mongolian Major of Infantry Victory parade tunic. Any chance of locating a brown "sam brown style leather belt with the brass open face buckle with the mongolian symbols inside of it for this uniform? I had a chance years ago to buy one but I did not know what it was!

Happy Hunting!

Vince

Edited December 7, 2007 by Ed_Haynes

[fjcp]

Nice looking tunic you've got there,

Would you be able to post a close up of the orders please????

Thanks

JC

Edited December 6, 2007 by fjcp

[Ed_Haynes]

I have to assume all these orders and medals are no more than fantasy additions, as they're the wrong things, in the wrong positions. Just extra rogue holes poked in the uniform that will confuse fiture owners.

[sftrooper86]

I have to assume all these orders and medals are no more than fantasy additions, as they're the wrong things, in the wrong positions. Just extra rogue holes poked in the uniform that will confuse fiture owners.

Hello Ed,

I purchased this item in 1992 on a business trip to Volgograd. It is what it is. There were no "fantasy" uniforms in Russia at that time. I was there and 6 additional times as well between the years 1992 and 1994. I brought back many uniforms (NKVD, Army, etc) before I even knew what they were.

Many were direct family purchases done in a very descrete manner as they thought we were the Militia trying to trap them into illegally selling STATE property.

It is a shame the collector community has become so paranoid, it started with the nazi stuff and now apparently it is in every facet of collecting.

I always welcome feedback from fellow collectors, even when it is not asked for. I am however looking for a Mongolian Officers leather belt and buckle to complete my display.

I welcome your assistance in this matter.

Sincerely,

Vince

[Ed_Haynes]

The uniform may well be fine. It is hard to tell from these images. I'd suspect it is OK.

All the awards are fantasy (at least as connected to this uniform) and are worn completely improperly.

Edited December 6, 2007 by Ed_Haynes

[sftrooper86]

The uniform may well be fine. It is hard to tell from these images. I'd suspect it is OK.

All the awards are fantasy (at least as connected to this uniform) and are worn completely improperly.

Fair enough,

What goes where and what does not belong?

Thanks

[Ed_Haynes]

Almost everything that is there is Soviet and even the Mongolian stuff is worn wrong. Not many Soviet awards were given to Mongolians and Mongolian awards are worn completely differently from Soviet style. Look at some of the other threads here, especially the "decorations in wear" thread. It is a Mongolian, not Soviet, uniform, although any effort to recover the history is probably now obscured by fantasy awards being added.

[NavyFCO]

I think that this uniform should most appropriately have the normal Soviet officer belt and buckle rather than the Mongolian one. Please correct me if there is documented regulation(s) otherwise.

With regard to the medals, the only way that we can know for certain that this uniform is right is if it gets researched. I have to disagree with the lack of "fantasy" uniforms during the early 90s in Russia, as that is when I lived there as well (1992-1996). Fantasy uniforms came from several sources: 1. modern ones were still being made, as well as being cleared out from former Soviet stores/depots. 2. Uniforms were coming out of museums that had been "decorated" for display (have photos of similar uniforms, somewhere in my office...) 3. Uniforms were coming out of theaters/movie studios en masse...certainly some of those probably had decorations on them from productions and 4. Dealers at the time were already peddling put together uniforms (as well as fake/remanufactured awards) cash is cash and whatever could make a profit...

Am I saying that this uniform fits all of these categories? No. Could it possibly have been one from a museum that went under? Quite certainly. Could the medals belonged to a single veteran, dating from his entire career, and randomly assembled on a single wartime uniform? Sure.

Lots of questions....not many answers.

I would say though that in all my time of hitting the flea markets in Moscow (and elsewhere), visiting families and looking at uniforms and awards they still owned, as well as dumpster diving (boy, did I get some odd looks from Russians - an American in the dumpster!!!) I never found a "from the family" uniform that still had the medals on it. It simply wasn't a practical way to store uniforms in the typically tiny Russian home (apartment).

Just my thoughts. Let's research it and see what comes. Maybe you really did get lucky and strike a gold mine - never know for certain without documented proof.

Dave

[Ed_Haynes]

If need be, I shall try to go into this in detail but:

-- This is NOT -- as I am told -- a Soviet uniform, it is said to be a Mongolian uniform, and should not have all these foreign Soviet awards, mounted Soviet style. It seems (from the description, catagory placement, and tiny-small off-forum virus-infested images) to be a Mongolian uniform.

-- Such profligate Soviet awards would not have been given to a Mongolian. It is another country. Soviet awards to Mongols are uncommon. And where are the Mongolian awards?? The collections of awards here are, freankly, laughable for any Mongolian. Even a Buriyat! And the addition of these lunatic-fantasy awards has obliterated the tunic's reclaimable history.

-- This mounting style and awards arrangmentwould have been as used by Mongolia (see multiple images in this sub-forum, please), not by the CCCP.

-- Any hypothetical belt would normally have been of the Mongolian style, not the Soviet. But this is the least of the issues.

Maybe better images, posted normally, would help?

Am I missing something here?!?!?!?!

[sftrooper86]

If need be, I shall try to go into this in detail but:

-- This is NOT -- as I am told -- a Soviet uniform, it is said to be a Mongolian uniform, and should not have all these foreign Soviet awards, mounted Soviet style. It seems (from the description, catagory placement, and tiny-small off-forum virus-infested images) to be a Mongolian uniform.

-- Such profligate Soviet awards would not have been given to a Mongolian. It is another country. Soviet awards to Mongols are uncommon. And where are the Mongolian awards?? The collections of awards here are, freankly, laughable for any Mongolian. Even a Buriyat! And the addition of these lunatic-fantasy awards has obliterated the tunic's reclaimable history.

-- This mounting style and awards arrangmentwould have been as used by Mongolia (see multiple images in this sub-forum, please), not by the CCCP.

-- Any hypothetical belt would normally have been of the Mongolian style, not the Soviet. But this is the least of the issues.

Maybe better images, posted normally, would help?

Am I missing something here?!?!?!?!

Yes, I simply want the Mongolian belt and buckle and nothing else. Copy?

Vince

[Ed_Haynes]

Then should this be moved into the "items wanted" category?

[NavyFCO]

-- This is NOT -- as I am told -- a Soviet uniform, it is said to be a Mongolian uniform, and should not have all these foreign Soviet awards, mounted Soviet style. It seems (from the description, catagory placement, and tiny-small off-forum virus-infested images) to be a Mongolian uniform.

I might be missing something myself... it looks to me to be a common Soviet rifles (pekhota) Major's parade uniform. It has the maroon piping for rifles, the hammer and sickle buttons, and expected wartime boards. How is it Mongolian? (I've only owned a few of these....)

Dave

[NavyFCO]

Yes, I simply want the Mongolian belt and buckle and nothing else. Copy?

Vince

Hi Vince:

This is the problem posting up something like this in a discussion forum... Be prepared to get comments/discussion on it, and sometimes differing opinions.

As for me, I've had several people e-mail me about this uniform asking my opinions on it - seems like perhaps a year or so ago. I told at least one of them exactly what I posted in my previous post about the fact that while there's a SMALL chance it could be real, it would have to be researched to be completely verified by research to conclusively state that it was real. Since you've owned it since bringing it from Russia, I assume that they did not buy it from you - I do not know if I'm responsible for that or not.

Anyway, I think it's a uniform worth discussing, and even moreso, I think it's a uniform that really is worth researching to prove that it's real - IF it is real. If it is, this is one hell of a gold mine of awards - both money wise but more importantly, the historical importance of this uniform.

Dave

[NavyFCO]

I was actually asked about this on 19 January 2007. Looking back through my old e-mail, the uniform has the following awards:

> On the medal bar; Battle merit #1239942

>

> Soviet Order of the Red star- 117672

>

> Order of the Patriotic War, 2nd Class- 319710

>

> Order of the Patriotic War, 1st Class- 78182

>

> WW2 Guards badge

>

> Mongolian Order of the Polar Star- 407

>

> Mongolian Order of Combat- 2059

>

> Mongolian Order of Military Merit- 4489

Dave

[Ed_Haynes]

Fair points Dave.

Altered the title and am shifting the thread to a Soviet forum.

(Although maybe a shift to "Want to Buy" would have been better?)

[Ferdinand]

(Although maybe a shift to "Want to Buy" would have been better?)

There already is a topic about the belt in 'Wanted Items':

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=23681

[Ed_Haynes]

There already is a topic about the belt in 'Wanted Items':

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=23681

Thanks. Though why you'd want to waste a Mongolian belt on a Soviet tunic, . . . ????

[meffert]

Sorry to add to a stale thread but I'm new on this forum and catching up. Webster and nelson show a number of mongolian awards on their uniforms, acknowledging that there are a number of problems with their photos. Still, would you like to explain to Marshal Budenny that he's not allowed to wear mongolian awards on his uniform? (Old style combat red banner, third down on the left). Not sure how a major would have earned this rack of mongolian awards but at least the senior officers usually have at least one foriegn award, including Konev wearing a US legion of merit.

[meffert]

And this marshal appears to have a new model combat red banner and a combat merit. In looking through marshall pictures, there are more than a half a dozen that have mongolian combat red banners (and bunches of norwegian, polish, hungarian, chinese, rumanian, US, other foriegn medals) I suppose halgingol was where future leaders made their mark

[Lapa]

Here is my Mongolian Major of Infantry Victory parade tunic. Any chance of locating a brown "sam brown style leather belt with the brass open face buckle with the mongolian symbols inside of it for this uniform? I had a chance years ago to buy one but I did not know what it was!

Happy Hunting!

Vince

Vince,

I concur with the previous opinions that were voiced. This is NOT a Mongolian uniform, but a M43 Soviet one. Just a few details:

. Buttons should not have the hammer and sickle

. Shoulder boards should be 5-sided, and should have Mongolian grid-like patterns instead of stars

. Collar devices should be only cloth tabs, no metallic ones

Do not waste your money purchasing a Mongolian belt for this uniform, that is not what is needed here.

Marc

[RichieC]

BUMP

To possibly help out:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Russian-Mongolian-Majors-Victory-Parade-Uniform-/150600497153?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item23107d3801

"A Russian/Mongolian Major of Infantry, 1945 Victory Parade Dress Tunic and Breeches.

Included in this offering are the following, Tunic with all pictured decorations, and Piped Breeches. I personally purchased this uniform set from an old Russian collector whom I met through my friend in Volgograd (Stalingrad), Russia when I visited there in 1992.

Here are the decorations which are original to this tunic:

On the medal bar: Battle Merit Medal - #1239942

Soviet Order of the Red Star - #117672

Order of the Patriotic War, 1st Class- #78182

Order of the Patriotic War, 2nd Class- #319710

WW2 Guards badge

Mongolian Order of the Polar Star- #407

Mongolian Order of Combat- #2059

Mongolian Order of Military Merit- #4489

All uniform items are in NEAR MINT condition and show only minor wear! Cannot be upgraded!

Please ask for additional photos as there are several more!

Shipping by U.S. Priority Mail, Insured. Shipping costs will be determined by your location. I accept payment by PAY PAL ONLY.

All items are 100% original as described and come with a 3-day inspection period. Please feel free to e-mail me with any questions.

Please check my other listings for related items.

Happy Hunting!"

Edited May 11, 2011 by RichieC