Fake One of the first fake Soviet order

[Bryan]

I took these picture on another forum. (http://warrelics.eu/forum/)

This seems to be one of the first fake Soviet order. The russian archive documents say that this order was made by the German intelligence services. The "spy" who had this order was arrested by the SMERSH in June 1945.

[Bryan]

Reverse

[Bryan]

Documents

Edited July 14, 2008 by Bryan

[Bryan]

Expert's report

[Paul R]

That is the best "repro" I have ever seen. What do the documents say?

[Ferdinand]

Yet easily recognisible for us collectors... Ugly enamel and a way too high serial number for a screwpost base Red Star.

[Ed_Haynes]

While there are lots of rumors (I am using a nice word) about these, this seems to have some evidence behind it. Good?

Thanks for sharing this.

[Guest Rick Research]

Actually, the "German uniforms" in the photos look far more dubious than the Red Star. (The Nagant revolver holster is as "off" as the tailoring. )

One would have to wonder WHY anybody would go to the expense and bother of producing fakes of something in readily available mass supply.

If, for any sane reason, a REAL German spy was kitted out with a Red Star right down to serial number and forged Orders Book, it would have been a simple matter of just taking one of countless numbers available from killed or captured Soviet personnel.

I would be more inclined to figure the report here itself was whipped up out of thin air in order to justify the existence of the personnel involved. Must have been tough ferreting out infiltrators who didn't exist. Made one look slack-- or perhaps working for the enemy oneself. That would have to explain lack of results.

We just saw a group posted in which the Commissar involved "uncovered" a steady stream of spies, saboteurs, and Vlasovites... at the end of the war in an ordinary infantry regiment.

Patent paranoid nonsense.

So I'd expect a SELF-concoction of the Soviet Security "Organs" rather than a dimwitted Nazi plot.

Scalps were being taken, at any excuse.

[Ed_Haynes]

Good points, Rick. I've always hard a hard time conconcing a plausible story to support these things.

[Alfred]

Here is his little brother, made out of brass.

regards

Andreas

[Alfred]

and reverse

[Guest Rick Research]

Until very recently (VERY recently) Red Stars were U.S. $15 items and not worth fakery. Oh, the numbers got screwed with and the marks were retro-fitted trying to Frankenstein later pieces into earlier ones and so on...

but from scratch?

That makes no sense...

except, perhaps, for Soviet veterans who had lost or damaged their originals and wanted a wearing copy but could not officially acquire a duplicate.

Now, of course, I'd expect fakes of everything.

But a fake that could not fool

ANYBODY

I would expect to be... something other than what we understand to be a "fake."

[Alfred]

Rick,

a friend of mine bought this piece a few month ago.

And we had the same thoughts as you. Why to make a detailed copy that nobody fools, for a relative cheap item.

It looks like the brass is struck and not casted.

We came to no conclusion. But may be it is a private made wearing copy of a veteran for the second suit.

best regards

Andreas

[Guest Rick Research]

That's what I'd say too. It is too much effort for something that had no "value" at the time to anyone BUT someone wearing it.