Cost of medals

[muckaroon1960]

Has anyone recently noticed the rise in the cost of medals, especially the more scarcer or gallantry ones?

The Millitary Cross from WW1 has increased, cased or uncased by as much as ?60 from some dealers whereas some of the more common medals seemed to have stayed in the same price range as 3 years ago? More scarcer medals like the territorial force war medal and the air crew europe are increasing in value.

Should we blame this on the credit crunch, seems odd but thinking about it maybe more people are buying into the medal market as a means of investment and especially the top end with orders and gallantry decorations as well as groups?

Recently thought about it myself, rather than leave money in the bank invest in a good set of medals.

However this would be a long term investment as selling them is usually via a dealer or auction (internet or otherwise) and the quick returns would not be there.

Has anyone had any experiences of price rises in this area? :)

[Kev in Deva]

Has anyone recently noticed the rise in the cost of medals, especially the more scarcer or gallantry ones?

The Millitary Cross from WW1 has increased, cased or uncased by as much as ?60 from some dealers whereas some of the more common medals seemed to have stayed in the same price range as 3 years ago? More scarcer medals like the territorial force war medal and the air crew europe are increasing in value.

Should we blame this on the credit crunch, seems odd but thinking about it maybe more people are buying into the medal market as a means of investment and especially the top end with orders and gallantry decorations as well as groups?

Recently thought about it myself, rather than leave money in the bank invest in a good set of medals.

However this would be a long term investment as selling them is usually via a dealer or auction (internet or otherwise) and the quick returns would not be there.

Has anyone had any experiences of price rises in this area?

Nothing whatsoever to do with the credit crunch,

IMHO there are two main values in regards military Decorations, the historic value and a monetary value.

it has more to do with the demand, many collectors specialize in specific areas,

the gallantry regardless of country are always in demand.

particularly so with WW1 medals as the 100th Anniversary draws near.

Another thing to be taken into consideration is that the rarer scarce orders

and decorations, again regardless of origin, are being bought as an investment with an eye on the future.

I can for example add 3% - 4% to the value of my collection yearly and see it reflected

in the prices being asked for and paid online or in auctions.

Kevin in Deva.

[muckaroon1960]

Thanks Kevin, I agree about monetary and collecting being the main reasons for prices of medals increasing. Personally with me it's the collecting and owning I enjoy but it is nice to know that what you are buying may increase with value assuming of course you haven't overspent? It would seem that the rarer medals are starting to go up in price due to availability but I was questioning if the current financial situation was causing investors to look elsewhere?

[Ulsterman]

Big question: quick answer.

I am an economist by vocation. Credit crunches/depressions do two things:

1. limit the number of buyers (fewer people have disposable income to spend)

2. lower or 'flatten' prices of more common items

This is true of the general art/antiques market as well as medals.

Rare items are always in demand.

They may not skyrocket in price overnight, but they are still in demand.

I suspect a third effect may be that 'lower end' collectors, bored with say, five black wound badges and EK2s and not comfortable with the price of an RK, may move to more affordable areas, like Communist nations.

[paul wood]

Big question: quick answer.

I am an economist by vocation. Credit crunches/depressions do two things:

1. limit the number of buyers (fewer people have disposable income to spend)

2. lower or 'flatten' prices of more common items

This is true of the general art/antiques market as well as medals.

Rare items are always in demand.

They may not skyrocket in price overnight, but they are still in demand.

Were it thus. The last Spink sale (Private collection) the prices on virtually everything were strong and I was blown out the water on many things I wanted, even though I was bidding very strongly (there were some things which I have in my collection which made considerably more than I had paid for them a couple of years ago and not just high end stuff: ?1-500 range as well).

All the best,

Paul

[FrontlineAntiques]

I have noticed a steep rise in medals towards the lower end of the spectrum (which is where most of my collecting sits!)

Single WWI victory and war medals are commonly achieving ?18, even to very basic recipients (pte/corps), which is an amount i was paying for pairs last year.

The average price of a war&victory pair is now nearer the ?30 mark than ?20.

I believe this to be due to the up anc coming centenary of wwi, with people putting the cheaper medals away to sell on in 2014 to people with the same surname at a marked increase in price.

Has anyone else encoutered this?

[Guest Rick Research]

Big question-- long answer.

I would attribute the ever increasing divergence in reality/sanity between prices (National Currency Unit quote unquote value) and ACTUAL intrinsic (historical) value to an influx of masses of uninformed speculators recklessly strewing cash (one wonders where they get it from, from their behaviour) at anything in hopes of miraculously recouping imaginary windfall profits.

In many cases, prices being paid for quite dull ordinary items are clinically insane.

That is because the persons behaving in this manner are NOT behaving rationally.

They are throwing away money on COMMON items because those are the items that they see. This is the level of knowledge that presumes a BWM is a VC. Too little knowledge is quite as financially dangerous as none at all-- and these two groups are the largest part of the disregard for immutable laws of supply and demand.

Everybody thinks they are an instant expert from watching TV, and there is an unfortunate seller-driven sales pitch To Get Yours N-O-W Before They're All Gone which is peculiarly effective on people with ZERO previous experience as specialist collectors. Ignorance is bliss until the very real squandered resources losses accrue.

The worst sort of self-interested hucksterism with the worst sort of blind gambling reflex.

Some of us have been actively involved in this hobby our entire lives. More than 40 years in my case. No matter what happens, I'm not "going away."

But people foolishly paying 500% of REAL "value" are going to screw up massively and drop out. They simply cannot SUSTAIN incredibly foolish buying.

Anybody who wants to quote unquote invest in this hobby, FOR quote unquote investing needs professional psychiatric assistance.

Buy land. Keep the cash in a sock under the mattress. (Banks? )

This is a LONG TERM hobby. Instant cash-in is virtually impossible--

and the people who think they CAN buy something for 500% real value today and sell it tomorrow for a profit are going to be sorely disappointed.

Any hobby NOT engaged in for current personal satisfaction, but driven by an impulse solely for imagined future profits is not a hobby--it is compulsive gambling. Just buy lottery tickets.

[paul wood]

:rolleyes: You most definitely do not want to buy medals to Indians from the Raj period, terrible investment, honestly.

Paul

[Guest Rick Research]

Right Paul-- good idea steering the punters out of the shoals. Another DEADLY mistake-to-even-try area is Imperial German. Yikes!!! NOBODY should buy that stuff. :catjava:

[Ulsterman]

No offense, but I have noticed that venue matters, especially where fakes are a problem (and where aren't they these days?.

However, more common items which languished a few months back are sometimes now being bought, albeit at 20%(+) off the higher end asking prices on eBay.

I have not noticed an uptick in Victory medals, but then again I am not looking. I don't think anyone except magazine editors really pays attention to 100 year anniversaries. Things sell if they are interesting and commemorations do create a "buzz", but gone are the days when "buzz" generated a massive boom in militaria buying.

Frankly, given the future of the world economy over the next two years, I suspect that many, many people are going to be cautious.

I have however, noticed that in some sales auctions, a great many items that I thought would sell have not met their reserve price.

The tale is told by typing in the word "medal" on search and then looking at the completed items sales every few days.

HOWEVER!!!!!!

As a hedge against the on-coming advent of inflation and higher tax rates, which many here have not really experienced in all its socio-political nastiness (has it been almost 30 years?)....higher end medals ARE a good investment. A Waterloo medal with provenance is ALWAYs almost as liquid as cash. Sorry cousin-it's true.

[Guest Rick Research]

I'm not so sure. The "investors" are individually like governments--

Throw money at "A," it doesn't work,

Throw money at "B," it doesn't work--

Hey, let's trying throwing money at "D" and see what happens, because "C" didn't work either.

There is apparently an inexhaustible supply of new people who are never going to progress beyond Let's See What Holding Our Hands On The Stove Burner Does.

These are people who actually do not CARE if something is real or fake-- as long as somebody else takes it off their hands for a profit.

That's enough to keep many professional dealers under a roof.

Doesn't do a thing for lifetime collectors.

[muckaroon1960]

It would be a shame if "investors" were pushing up the price of medals just to try and gain a quick return (as some seem to be when it comes to oil)?

Those of us who do genuinely collect do receive a lot of satisfaction from obtaining our medals at the price we are happy to pay. It's a case of swings and roundabouts, sometimes one has to pay the going rate, other times you luck in at the right time and place and pick up a bargain.

:D

[regimentalrogue]

Speculation may drive medal prices to new heights during the centennial of the Great War, but what happens after 2018? Some medals may trade at increasing prices for a few years, but after 2018 when only the long term collectors are buying, there may be a lot of people surprised to learn that their hyped purchase prices won't hold in a market consisting of just the collectors as the spur of the moment types have moved on to the next fad. And for those folks, they'll probably sell them off for whatever they can get once the novelty of having "a Great War trio just like Great-Granddad would have worn" wears off. I suspect at least some collectors, who may be used to recent steady rises in prices, will simply sit back for a while and waiting for the market to restore itself to the current trajectory. (Then again, there is always the sacrifice to be made when a "must have" shows itself on the market, and those medals will undoubtedly constitute the exceptions.)

[Mervyn Mitton]

Hi - RR. Welcome to GMIC. I don't think the centenary of WW1 will cause a great increase in medal demand - it certainly didn't for the Boer War. What is definetly pushing up prices of medals and badges is the current economic concern. The reasons are well covered in earlier postings - however at times such as these people look for small, easily transportable items. Gold and other bullion items, paintings , medals and badges, stamps. I know of at least two people who always carry valuable stamps in their wallets - even if you only get 50% of what you paid - that could be sufficient to get you out of trouble.

With regard to WW1 the scope and complexity of the battles and troop movements is probably far beyond ordinary peoples understanding - certain events will be covered in detail , but the day to day happenings cannot be covered for four years. The public like short campaigns - i.e. The Anglo-Zulu War 0f 1879 - six months was quite long enough.

[Michael Johnson]

I do think that the centenary will result in many families trying to track down the medals that were sold off over the years.

[Alex K]

In the end, if we're all to be completely honest, we all talk about the interest in collecting our chosen items and costs are secondary to the pleasure of owning the item, this may well be true. The reality is that whilst we may pay lip service to this notion, we all like to feel that we have been very prudent or intuitive in obtaining a rare/valuable item or one which, in time will become such.

When the time comes to "Move the Item on" preconceived ideas as to values, real or otherwise, based on unrealistic Internet sales rooms takes over and this will in itself generate an completely unrealistic impression of a pieces worth. Unfortunately, the Internet sales rooms sites are full of numpties with far greater cash than brains which rack up values to a far higher level than they really deserve. By all means enjoy your collection, feel, touch, stroke or any other way that you communicate with your beloved pieces, but the reality is, with the exception of a very few exceptionally rare pieces, common sense should prevail

Just a thought

Alex K

[muckaroon1960]

"Swing and Roundabouts" comes to mind! With collecting medals or any other items there are days when you will undoubtedly find a bargain and others where you will pay over the odds? It happens to us all but like "Alex K" has said, we should enjoy "our"collections and I always say you have something to pass on when you are gone or sell if you decide you no longer want or need it?

My only other tip to collectors is do your research and shop around. The internet has provided us and those people who are not mobile or live in isolated areas with access to greater choice but also provided a comparison of other outlets.

I look to buy in all areas, from the internet, shops, shows and boot markets but I always try to research any particular item I am after especially the cost.

Relax and enjoy!

[Brian Wolfe]

Speculation may drive medal prices to new heights during the centennial of the Great War, but what happens after 2018? Some medals may trade at increasing prices for a few years, but after 2018 when only the long term collectors are buying, there may be a lot of people surprised to learn that their hyped purchase prices won't hold in a market consisting of just the collectors as the spur of the moment types have moved on to the next fad. And for those folks, they'll probably sell them off for whatever they can get once the novelty of having "a Great War trio just like Great-Granddad would have worn" wears off. I suspect at least some collectors, who may be used to recent steady rises in prices, will simply sit back for a while and waiting for the market to restore itself to the current trajectory. (Then again, there is always the sacrifice to be made when a "must have" shows itself on the market, and those medals will undoubtedly constitute the exceptions.)

Nothing to add to the post.

I just wanted to welcome you to the GMIC, good to see another fellow "Southern" Ontario resident on the forum.

Regards

Brian