France Colonial and Overseas medal

[Chris Boonzaier]

Ed suggested a seperate thread for these..

I am tempted to think just reading Hendriks site negates any possible reason for having a thread, but lets see how it goes.

here is my own OM, a bit beaten and nowhere near the quality of the old silver ones....

[Chris Boonzaier]

This is the award document (Jack brewster = Chris Boonzaier, long story but not that intresting) for the Tchad one.

Unfortunately my certificate for the Middle east bar was lost when I was in Central Africa. We had to go to Zaire to evacuate the Europeans and stayed there 4 weeks. In the meantime back in Bangui the staybehinds packed our kit. I had the award document for the Middle east bar and my citation in between the pages of an old magazine, which was thrown away and lost forever.

Funny thing was, there is a Zaire clasp for the medal as well, had been awarded for years, but the awards were stopped just weeks before Operation Baumier, (1991) so we missed out on that.

Edited November 30, 2005 by Chris Boonzaier

[Chris Boonzaier]

Me left, Mitch right, just after the return from the Gulf.

[Ed_Haynes]

Chris (Jack),

Your point about possible non-need for another presentation, given the existing fine site, is well taken, but an interesting start nevertheless.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Chris (Jack),

Your point about possible non-need for another presentation, given the existing fine site, is well taken, but an interesting start nevertheless.

Hi,

I figured, you never know what comes out of the woodwork.

Hendriks site almost made me start off another branch of collecting, but the wife whistled me back and pointed out I can't do it all :-(

[Chris Boonzaier]

By the way, a bit off topic, the Appui sign on the back of the door, those are crossed Mortars and Milan missiles, NOT whatever you think they look like.

We had just hung that up. The Saturday night before had seen a lot of beverages consumed in our room, listening to the Pogues and so a knife throwing competition developed the door suffereing as a consequence. The next day the sign was found way back in the section storeroom and very quickly put up.. you can still see a few chips around the side though...

[Hendrik]

Thanks for the compliment on my site, Chris/Jack

I'll be most happy to oblige and answer questions to the best of my ability on this, one of my favourites, topic ... Pictures of medals and/or bars posted would be great as they may lead to discovering "new" (as in previously unknown) types. By way of example, I've not yet seen the "Mission Saharienne", "Gabon-Congo" for the Colonial Medal or even the bar for the 'Democratic Republic of Congo' operations for the Overseas Medal.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Thanks for the compliment on my site, Chris/Jack

I'll be most happy to oblige and answer questions to the best of my ability on this, one of my favourites, topic ... Pictures of medals and/or bars posted would be great as they may lead to discovering "new" (as in previously unknown) types. By way of example, I've not yet seen the "Mission Saharienne", "Gabon-Congo" for the Colonial Medal or even the bar for the 'Democratic Republic of Congo' operations for the Overseas Medal.

I would be curious to know the exact date that the Zaire bar was discontinued. I know the cut off point was made to events BEFORE operation baumier, but I think this rule may have been made AFTER the operation.

[Hendrik]

I would be curious to know the exact date that the Zaire bar was discontinued. I know the cut off point was made to events BEFORE operation baumier, but I think this rule may have been made AFTER the operation.

ZA?RE : for operations between 13 May 1978 and 1 July 1990 ... Seems you were indeed just to late for that one and too early for the R?PUBLIQUE DU CONGO (from 6 June 1997 onwards).

[Dave Danner]

I suppose I can add something anyway:

[Hendrik]

I suppose I can add something anyway

Of course, Dave ! Do examine the medal's rim for maker's marks or silver marks (probably not there in view of the type concerned) and on the reverse of the bar ... always useful to do so but I have a very, very strong suspicion you already know that

[Chris Boonzaier]

Here are 2 of obviously different quality...

Earlier one has Argent stamped in the rim, later one has Bronze stamped.

[Chris Boonzaier]

The earlier is one of the medals it would be a crime to clean. I even like the fact that it has bees repaired.

[Chris Boonzaier]

This guy had a 4 bar one.

http://www.amicale-online.ca/modules.php?n...content&tid=259

From his diverse awards (Chuter ops, Tireur d'elite, Milan... ) and the fact he was in the REP and served in the Gulf, he must have been in a deep recon unit. (Only REP units in the Gulf)

Edited November 30, 2005 by Chris Boonzaier

[Hendrik]

The earlier is one of the medals it would be a crime to clean. I even like the fact that it has bees repaired.

Chris,

The one with the Extreme Orient bar is an Arthus-Bertrand manufacture which after 1945 was used to award combattants in Indochina ... Nice one !

Now as to the "earlier one" : is there a "1" in front of the "ARGENT" and are those between two maker's marks ? If so, it's the so called intermediary type by the Paris Mint.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Chris,

Now as to the "earlier one" : is there a "1" in front of the "ARGENT" and are those between two maker's marks ? If so, it's the so called intermediary type by the Paris Mint.

Right you are. A 1 and 2 funny skwiggles...

[Ed_Haynes]

Just a few more:

M?daille Coloniale: ?Maroc 1925-1926?

Awarded primarily for actions against Abd-el-Krim, which culminated in his surrender on 23 May 1926.

[Ed_Haynes]

M?daille Coloniale: ?Maroc?

Awarded for a wide range of French service in Morocco:

1843-47: It is not entirely clear that this medal was retroactively extended for this service, but some sources suggest that the award included actions into Morocco against Abdul el-Qadir from Algeria by the 1er regiment of the Foreign Legion.

1914-25: Replacing the Morroco Campaign's Commemorative Medal, this clasp was awarded for peacekeeping operations between 1914 and 1925. It was also awarded to members of the societies that cared for the military wounded in the area between 20 July 1912 and 31 December 1913 for two consecutive months.

[Hendrik]

1843-47: It is not entirely clear that this medal was retroactively extended for this service, but some sources suggest that the award included actions into Morocco against Abdul el-Qadir from Algeria by the 1er regiment of the Foreign Legion.

Hi Ed,

I couldn't find anything to corroborate a retroactive award of the Colonial Medal +"Maroc" bar for the 1843-47 period. It seems doubtful though (and hardly worth the trouble) as possible recipients remaining would have been very few in number by the time the bar was created (1914). In those days people didn't live all that long especially not if they had served in the more exotic parts of the world ...

The Commemorative Medal for Morocco was instituted on 22 July 1909 and was rendered obsolete by being replaced with the Colonial Medal with "Maroc" bar on 15 April 1925 although the latter had already been in existence since 28 April 1914 and had been awarded retroactively for operations from 20 July 1912 onwards ... somehow there appears to be an overlap of over 10 years. I would, therefore, not be surprised if during that time both medals could have been awarded to a single person.

To complicate matters even more, the "Maroc 1925" bar, very quickly replaced by the "Maroc 1925-1926" one, were instituted (resp. on 6 January 1926 and 30 December 1926) but only lasted till 20 May 1927 when the French reverted to the original "Maroc" bar.

It does appear as if the powers that were couldn't really make up their minds about it all

For the sake of completion : here's a picture of the Commemorative Medal for Morocco (1909)

[attachmentid=18552]

[Chris Boonzaier]

Realating to this thread...

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=12485

can anyone say with any authority WHY the Tchad bar is still awarded? Is operation "Epervier" still going?

[Dave Danner]

Realating to this thread...

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=12485

can anyone say with any authority WHY the Tchad bar is still awarded? Is operation "Epervier" still going?

Yes

http://www.defense.gouv.fr/sites/ema/enjeu...erieures/tchad/

[Chris Boonzaier]

OK,

I thought it was loooong over.

Here are some others....

a modern one and an old one

[Chris Boonzaier]

back...

[Chris Boonzaier]

Here are 3 Outre mers (Including an old silver one) and a colonial...

[Chris Boonzaier]

and the backs with the order changed...