A friendly reminder to be careful.......

[Stogieman]

Some additional photos of the latest batches of fake Prussian & bavarian Badges on the market.

[Stogieman]

Reverse of pilot:

[Stogieman]

Notice how very close they are in many, many respects. Detail of maker mark:

[Stogieman]

The Prussian Observer fake:

[Stogieman]

Reverse of Observer

[Stogieman]

An odd side shot:

[Stogieman]

These little gems have been cast from originals. Under magnification, the casting pock marks become glaringly obvious. In addition, they're about slightly shorter than an original badge. Width is almost perfect. In addition to Pilot & Observer; a similar design/constructed Prussian Aerial Gunner Badge bearing fake Meybauer maker marks has been observed. The design follows Meybauer badges correctly with respects to correct style of crown and ribbon on the front. reverse bears 3 fake rivet impressions to give the illusion that the bird is riveted together a la Juncker..............

Use Caution!!!!!!

[David Gregory]

Stogie,

Thanks for posting these. I am taking my time to do my homework before acquiring an example of each of these.

Could you post the auction numbers or the name of the seller for future reference, please?

Thanks in advance,

David

[Stogieman]

Hi David, I don't have the numbers, snagged these photos awhile back. The badges are not offered by any one individual..... they show up in both the US, the UK and Europe from a multitude of sellers. Beware of ones with the pins snapped off....... look very closely, a snapped pin and there's a high probability it's one of these.

[Bob Hunter]

Well done, Rick! Thanks for the heads up!

[Mike Dunn]

"These little gems have been cast from originals. Under magnification, the casting pock marks become glaringly obvious. In addition, they're about slightly shorter than an original badge. Width is almost perfect. In addition to Pilot & Observer; a similar design/constructed Prussian Aerial Gunner Badge bearing fake Meybauer maker marks has been observed. The design follows Meybauer badges correctly with respects to correct style of crown and ribbon on the front. reverse bears 3 fake rivet impressions to give the illusion that the bird is riveted together a la Juncker.............."

Why even bother to try and buy these without holding them in hand? If it takes "magnification" to see the faults--damn--stop collecting them and let the stock piles of fakes stay in their hands. If it takes magnification to determine an original to a fake--stop buying any of them online and put a dent in the fake market...

Also, would it be possible to point out why the badge is a fake? Maybe an arrow pointing to the reason? Just to post a photo and say it is fake really does not show the reason why. Mike

Edited January 2, 2006 by Mike Dunn

[Mike Dunn]

Another thought comes to mind on Imperial flight badges..lets say you buy one that is "good' from someone who "knows". Then you deside to part with it and there is a question about it..How can one "prove" that it is a period piece? While these badges are wonderful to look at, nice to talk about--they are a fricking mine field and one that requires very careful steps. I would love to own some-but never will because the seem to be so damn hard to authenticate. Oh well--just a new years thought I guess. Mike

[Stogieman]

And therein lies much of the problem Mike. The best and first thing you can do is only buy the badge from someone you know and trust to know what the heck they are doing. Whomever they are, make sure they offer an iron-clad return policy on authenticity.

You can't buy these from photographs unless you relly know what you're doing and even then there's a very large margin for error..... Let's look at another clever offering:

[Stogieman]

Additional view:

[Stogieman]

And another view:

[Stogieman]

And the maker's mark:

[Luftmensch]

Not easy...the case is completely not standard, and maybe a tip-off that someone's dressing up a sow's ear. Has that uneven hallmark been darkened?

[Stogieman]

Unaltered foto as offered by the seller of the cased badge

[Luftmensch]

Unaltered foto as offered by the seller of the cased badge

Okay, I've been burning incense and meditating to try and tap into Stogie's higher consciousness on this one...

Could the weak hallmarking be a tipoff of a cast job? The hallmarking could have been rolled but it just looks weak, the letters even a little dubious, and maybe chemically darkened? I guess you'd really need a loupe to confirm that everything has sharp edges. And that box is bogus.

[Luftmensch]

On second thought, if it's cast, it's from a bogus badge. I don't like the lettering or spacing. Here's Otto's...

Edited January 2, 2006 by Luftmensch

[Stogieman]

or maybe you could just save the photo of the back of Luftmensch's badge and come to the Nirvana that if it's Juncker, it better look EXACTLY like his. This will be irrespective of whether the badge bears full marks, or just the moon 800. It better be the same..............

The badge in the case is bogus. The mark is bogus. I have no clue what the case is, but it is NOT a period case by Juncker, or by Meybauer.

[Luftmensch]

come to the Nirvana...

So next time you're in doubt at a show, chant

Ommmm Stogiemani padme hummm for enlightenment

but carry a picture of Otto's badge in your wallet.

Edited January 3, 2006 by Luftmensch

[Claudius]

Hello, (new member here);

Any advice then on someone who is contemplating a purchase on the authenticity of a Bav. Pilot badge. Let's just suppose, I have a photo of the badge (the back). Would it be possible to be comfortable with the badge? I understand that without holding it, it would be impossible to be 100%, but a photo goes a long way.

Thanks in advance.

Bav_Pilot_badge_4_sale.htm

[Stogieman]

Claudius, your photo isn't showing up. Front & back would be better.

[Claudius]

Claudius, your photo isn't showing up. Front & back would be better.

I can't seem to get a photo to attach to my replies. The message is that the size of the photo is too large. "The total filespace required to upload all the attached files is greater than your per post or global limit. Please reduce the number of attachments or the size of the attachments."