Greek Victory Medals

[lambert]

Hello Tim

it's great to have you back!!!

It is an exceptional group.

Thank you for showing

 

Lambert

 

 

 

[Tim B]

Thank you my friend, good to be back!

Cheers!

[Bilco]

Hi Tim,

 

A very nice group! And as Lambert said, it's good to see you posting again. I think you welcomed me to GMIC when I joined!

 

Bill

[Tim B]

Bill,

Yes, I believe I did.  Happy to see you still here and the Vic section seems to be doing well!

[RobW]

Welcome back Tim,

Another collector of vics, in this forum, is a good thing.

Regards,

Rob

[Tim B]

Thanks Rob!

[lambert]

Hello Tim,

could post pictures of brings the Greek group? I like to see how they were assembled.

 

Lambert

[Tim B]

Hello Lambert,

I'm not sure what you meant by "brings" but here's a shot of the reverse of the medal bar.  Hard to show much more as for the construction as its sewn fairly well.  I left the pic large so you should be able to see details.

The set actually came with two ribbons bars, both identical setups but the attachments have some interesting variations.  I am trying to ask more about it in the Greek medal section but have found little interest as of yet.

If you need to see anything else, just let me know!

Tim

[lambert]

Sorry.
Yes that's what I meant ...


I like to observe how they were assembled. some are montandos by professional companies for other fighters proud but with limited resources. these are quite interesting.

 

Lambert

[lambert]

Another Greek group for consideration.
see how they were assembled improvised way.

 

Lambert

[Tim B]

Hi Lambert,

Yes, we see this everywhere, even in today's modern examples.  I think it comes down to two things:

1) Who is doing the mounting and what capabilities/experience they have in mounting medals.

2) How much money you want/can pay to have them mounted.

In the first case, uniform shops often have someone on staff or some outside vendor that does this and it all depends on the individual doing the work.  I've had my medals mounted several times over a 20+ career.  Sometimes they simply remove the original suspension ribbon and use material on a roll, sometimes they cheap out and cut and re-use that original ribbon.  Backing material has been anywhere from very nice to nothing.

In the second case, back in the day, I would imagine the person would have to find someone in the business and pay whatever those costs were.  Again, how nice of a setup you get probably is determined how much you can afford or want to spend on it.  I knew guys that didn't want to pay and would often take the back attachment pin off and slide the medals on a ribbon bar rack.  Didn't look the best but for a few medals it worked.

Tim

Edited August 5, 2015 by Tim B

[Paul Oakley]

Good afternoon Gentleman. I am new to the site and was wondering if you would be kind enough to help me with your thoughts. I have just bought this version of the medal which is not maker-marked. I appreciate that the suspension ring is distorted. Do you think it is a reproduction? My major concern is that there is evidence of a seam on the edge. In addition, there is something of a glossy sheen to the medal itself. I would be very grateful for your observations.

Another photograph

[lambert]

Hello Paul,

Welcome. His example is a Type 3, different strikes, especially in the form of the bail. This model does not bear the signature of the sculptor and, on the reverse, absence of the Greek article " O ".

Lambert

 

[Paul Oakley]

Many thanks Lambert. As my VM collection expands further away from western Europe my knowledge decreases as I've had less chance to handle a variety of original examples. Given the sub-industry for restrikes which has developed, fakes (and the consequential wrath of my wife) are particularly worrying when I eventually invest in a Cuban version.

[lambert]

It will be a pleasure to help you find a good example for their collection.

feel free to ask

 

[Tim B]

Paul,

Here's one of mine and you can see the reverse on the official issue has the letter "O", where your example is missing that.

I know very little on these "missing O" varieties but they are starting to show up more and more on venues like Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Victory-Medal-RARE-Greek-missing-O-WW-1-era-Inter-allied-medal-/281768720332?hash=item419ab977cc

So, what does mean???  Perhaps others like Rob or one of the Greek members here can comment better as they might have a better handle on what's going on with these in particular.  Rare, copy, ??

 

Also, I too am looking for a nice Cuban example however, I have seen a couple sell on Ebay recently that others have told me were fakes, so...

Good luck!

Tim

 

[Paul Oakley]

Thanks again Lambert and thanks Tim. I see from the link you sent that the seller has added the comment "later production". Wondering if it might be a restrike/replacement version for the original recipients. . .

[RobW]

To all,

The example in question, was produced by the Paris firm of M.Delande. They are generally of high production quality and are deemed to be 'unofficial' according to the authorative Laslo reference.

Of note is that on the reverse of the suspension ring are the stamped words 'MADE IN FRANCE'. This at least dates the piece to having being produced circa 1931, as it was a requirement to have country of origin labeling to comply with US laws of the time.

Regards,

Rob

[Tim B]

Hi Rob,

Yes, I read that in Laslo's book as well.  So, similar to the Studely offerings in the late 1920's through '40s, only in Greece/Europe.  Of course, he also sold foreign medals in addition to American items.

A bit off the Greek topic and more on the American front but it applies in this case here.  What I find troubling is the double standard some collectors always seem to have with labeling period pieces marketed by George Studely as total reproduction and crap, but have absolutely no issues with the ones produced by companies like Delande, etc.

I know some collectors that even willingly accept current manufactured examples from companies like Graco/Northwest Territorial Mint or Ira Green and consider them authentic because some relative petitioned for the service member's medals 70 years after the fact and got them through official channels.  Considering Studley was authorized by the government to sell items back in the 1920's to 1940's, I don't understand why some people will not accept something the vet actually purchased from his catalog back in the 1920's.  Ridiculous in my opinion but to each his own I guess. 

To be fair; the definition of reproduction loosely translates as "a copy or duplicate of an original", so within the context of collecting anything produced after the initial production of an item is, by definition, a copy or reproduction.  Understand we can debate the definitions of re-issues, restrikes, etc. until we are blue in the face, so... let's not here.

Anyway,

Tim

[oliver860]

Hello! 

Who collectors have Unofficial type 3 - without the name Henri Nocq 

and with "O" on the reverse?

Show the photo, please!

Regards

[oliver860]

Hello!

Want to buy!

I consider that this is the original!

Any comments welcome

Oliver

1

[Bilco]

Hi Oliver - yes, this looks to be a good Official Type.

Bill

[oliver860]

Thank you, Bill!

[oliver860]

Hello!

Does anyone have a photo of Unofficial type 3?

And a photo of the medal with Made in France?

Yours faithfully

[lambert]

On 10/06/2017 at 10:46, oliver860 said:

Hello!

Does anyone have a photo of Unofficial type 3?

And a photo of the medal with Made in France?

Yours faithfully

Hope it helps .. are photos from Jim's Book

Lambert