Soviet NKVD Uniform

[RichieC]

IMAGE7 & FIN

Edited February 15, 2006 by RichieC

[Stogieman]

Hi Richie, very similar to mine. Major differences: Slightly different background material for the bullion, but the bullion looks like a spot-on match. My bars are pronged-back, but the only set of holes through the tab and collar, so made this way and never changed. I think Rick said the tunic was dated 1939 and was marked for a Minsk manufacturer. My cap was also updated to the war-time star and then never touched again. The chinstrap is almost flawless, but very much hardened into place right over the star. I think any attempt to shift it would end up breaking it into pieces. Amazing to think that the tunic and cap are basicly untouched for 60+ years...... no real mothing that I could find anywhere.

[RichieC]

This area of the Militaria collecting hobby sure is a challenge...

However, it is always exhilarating to discuss, gather opinions, and if need be, debate... There exists not any 100% accurate reference material available, so let us just have fun comparing notes...

There are a lot of well thought out and created farces out there though... IMO, date stamps are the premiere tool of the creators and purveyors of the "disclaimer injected described" numbers of fakes coming out of Eastern Europe over the course of the past few years.

I still think that your cap is a M27 that has a M35 replacement visor and a postwar chinstrap... I am not knocking it in any way, because they really did those types of mods back then...

Give me time and I will post period photos of guys wearing combinations of uniforms that many of the "professors" will say: "They never did that Richie. I care not what you say. Its' a fantasy piece."

In any case, back to our recreation; Model 1943 NKVD tunic with boards that were designed and used strictly by NKVD troops until 1947...

Richie C

[Stogieman]

Are those the infamous "Bottle Boards"??

[Stogieman]

PS: The chinstrap is the correct coated oilcloth... not plastic, or some other synthetic material....

[Guest Rick Research]

There is no evidence that the visor was ever anything than what is on there, the small square type won until replaced by the postwar "duckbills." While in excellent USED condition, it is rather stiff and not anything that has been reworked in many decades, if that. The chinstrap is the type of ?oilcloth apparently supposed to look like patent leather found on wartime caps. I have no experience of pre-WW2 visor caps.

It is marked

Fka im Kominterna

g. Kuibyshev

R59 S II

ZAKAZ 04 1933 g.

(Factory "in the name of the Comintern," city of Kuibyshev, Size 59, Quality 2, Made/contracted April 1933")

A very nice scan of the collar. The just cannot get the domed translucent rank devices right-- yet anyway.

[attachmentid=27658]

[Guest Rick Research]

[attachmentid=27659]

Gimnastyorka marked

X hammer and sickle 39 g.

Fabrika im. Z(illegible)

g. Minsk

and lines with spaces which appear to be blank

R and S over

? and Sh

[Guest Rick Research]

Lovely soft things these are, left sleeve, right sleeve.

[attachmentid=27660]

The breeches are marked

Leningrad

F-ka Krasny May

19 (hammer and sickle) 41

[Guest Rick Research]

Unfortunately (as will become apparent) my attempts at CAMERA shots of Uniforms In Entirety are miserable blurry pathetic failures (small vilons playing mournfully in the background) leading me to scan closeups of bits and pieces. I hav many many many State Security, but the only probably pre-1943 is this Colonel's overcoat, which OI believe from the shade and number of buttons orginally had pre-943 rank tabs on it and was updated per the new regulations.

A scan of a printout of the original catalog page from Pre-Internet days, and two of my own feeble camera shots, front and back:

[attachmentid=27661]

[attachmentid=27662][attachmentid=27663]

scanned lapel and tab:

[attachmentid=27664]

[Guest Rick Research]

Closer tab, and board

[attachmentid=27665]

[attachmentid=27666]

[Guest Rick Research]

The Liptonsky Chai Comrade's jacket.

My bad. No, really, BAD camera shots.

M1943 summer kitel tunic, M1940 11 Republics buttons, Major General of State Security

[attachmentid=27667]

Scan of waffle weave

[attachmentid=27668]

Boards have alas faded an ugly dark grayish color along the visible edge and are only blueberry blue underneath.

[attachmentid=27669]

[Guest Rick Research]

State Security Senior Lieutenant M1943 kitel tunic

[attachmentid=27670]

Board close up

[attachmentid=27671]

This is rather rougher wool than I'd have expected for such a semi-exalted personage because, lookee heyuh:

[attachmentid=27672]

all flaps, no pockets.

[Guest Rick Research]

Now THIS Major is quite nice-- and exceptionally well decorated with a Nevsky etc. Not a replaced 13 ribbon bar either since it has been in there so long the pin has left rust stains where it fits.

Alas, I will torture you no more with any more Crappy Camera Shots, tonight anyway

[attachmentid=27673]

And yes, the dark blue breeches are indeed piped-- for all it shows in... dark blue.

This particular set fits me, being a 6 foot 2 size 44L U.S. type Comrade, so eventually perhaps I shall model it for a better look.

[Gerd Becker]

This particular set fits me, being a 6 foot 2 size 44L U.S. type Comrade, so eventually perhaps I shall model it for a better look.

I would even pay to see that

Great uniforms

Rick, any chance of a closeup of the ribbon-bar or the Major, you posted last?

Gerd

[Stogieman]

Rick, thanks for the additional scans.

[RichieC]

Great work Rick... The photos included. Your attention to detail is greatly admired.

The ones that you mentioned came from an old pre-internet catalogue could have been worse; They could be scans of old Xerox'd pages from the pre-color copier days.

I wish I had additional examples of NKVD/KGB cloth to show... Perhaps someday after Dave Webster wills his entire collection all to me...

Anyway, I can post examples of different models of visor caps if any of the fellows are interested in seeing the differences that seperate them.

Edited February 16, 2006 by RichieC

[Guest Rick Research]

Start a new thread on just the caps. The longer these get, the longer it takes those of us on Hamster Generators to download.

I have nothing before the 1950s, SS cap-wise.

[Stogieman]

OK, who's going to open the cap thread!! That would be interesting!!

[Guest Darrell]

This particular set fits me, being a 6 foot 2 size 44L U.S. type Comrade, so eventually perhaps I shall model it for a better look.

Pics Pics !!!

[Stogieman]

Uh, you don't really want to go there, do you?

Think Chaplin's "Littlest Dictator"! ;>)

[Guest Darrell]

Uh, you don't really want to go there, do you?

Think Chaplin's "Littlest Dictator"! ;>)

[Ed_Haynes]

On account of some recent "uniform dabbling", I shall soon be adding some details of these two. Therefore, rescurrecting a long-moribund thread.

1- M1940-42 Commissar General of the NKVD Frontier Troops.

2- M1943 NKVD-NKGB Lieutenant uniform, "bottle boards".

Edited September 4, 2007 by Ed_Haynes

[Guest Rick Research]

Ed's gone clothee! Ed's gone clothee!

Best start a NEW thread.

[Ed_Haynes]

Shall do so, for each, when in hand.

Need something for display in the off-to-college-absent-daughter-reclaimed collection space. (Pray -- to all the gods -- for me in this quest.)

Edited September 4, 2007 by Ed_Haynes

[Daredevil]

...its kinda odd to see Buddha looking around the corner of the commissar....