Sometimes a huge rack of fruit salad means something

[tonytdyagain]

[attachmentid=33794]

Hello all,

Still serving in the Air Force now a little more than 21 years, I have received my fair share of ridicule for my "Fruit Salad", but it does take a little more than perfect attendance and a handful of smiley faces to receive awards and decorations. Having served most of my career in Special Operations and Combat Search and Rescue units, I have deployed to just about every conflict since Operation Just Cause (Panama). I feel that I have earned each and every one of my salad pieces asnd damn proud of it.

I agree, there are a handful of senior NCOs and officers that get something for a papercut sitting in Italy during Bosnia, or a Bronze star for working the ramp in the Mid-West US during Operation Anaconda (Afghanistan). But more often than not, there are many men and women out there right now serving their countries and making a difference on the global war on terror, that are there for a purpose and not for pretty pieces of cloth to wear. Me personally, I would rather go over someplace and take the fight to the terrorists, and the common civilian never know about it, than to have my picture in the paper or on the news saying how great and wonderful we all are.

So the next time you see an impressive Fruit salad on a great and proud warrior, take the time to thank them and to admire the sacrifice they give each and every day to keep the world a free and wonderful place to live. Think of the fruit salad as our resume to the world as a silent reminder of what we do and where we go so you don't have to.

Thanks for letting me rant. Have a great and peaceful day.

Tony

"Support Search and Rescue...Get Lost!!!"

[Kev in Deva]

[attachmentid=33794]

Hello all,

So the next time you see an impressive Fruit salad on a great and proud warrior, take the time to thank them and to admire the sacrifice they give each and every day to keep the world a free and wonderful place to live. Think of the fruit salad as our resume to the world as a silent reminder of what we do and where we go so you don't have to.

Thanks for letting me rant. Have a great and peaceful day.

Tony

"Support Search and Rescue...Get Lost!!!"

Hallo Tony,

I am in total agreement, no matter what or when or where or why, the job comes first and foremost, there will always be those who get their hands on ribbons, clasps, and medals for being in the right place at the right time, (unlike the combat grunts who are in the right place at the wrong time as the bullets are flying )

Kevin in Deva ( thats deep dark Transylvania, where after eight, Garlic necklaces are a must and not a fashion accessorie )

[NavyFCO]

I would like to pose a question. What would be your reaction if you observed a green service tunic of a Marine Master Sergeant adorned with the following decorations: Air Medal with three stars, Marine Good Conduct medal with four stars, Army Good Conduct medal, ETO with one star, American Defense Medal, WWII Victory Medal, AAF Air Crew wings, Marine Air Crew wings? Would like very much to have your obser-vations. Regards, Jack

Jack-

In my opinion, this is either one of two things... Either it's been messed with, or it's being worn by someone who doesn't give a rip about regulations. It's not an impossible group, but certainly a very odd one that would have to be one of a kind if real. The only thing I can't quite figure out is the Air Medal with the stars, which leads me to think that he may have earned olc's as an Army aircrewman and then "converted" them to stars himself. I think having four Air Medals without combat in the Marine Corps is next to impossible. Also, where is his National Defense?

Just my two cents...

Dave

[NavyFCO]

When a service member sports only five awards of which you have a DSC, Silver Star and Purple Heart, as compared to someone with lesser awards but considerably more in number, which tells the real story of valor and dedication to duty?

I tend to look at it a little differently... A rack with a DSC and Silver Star definately shows more valor than someone who doesn't have those awards, but I would argue that those awards have very little to do with devotion to duty. In my opinion, I think devotion to duty can be rarely measured by awards on the chest, though if there's anyone who can show devotion to duty, someone with a chest like Tony could definately be considered to have "devotion" - he's been in every hot spot possible over the past 20 years.

I've owned too many groups of and have seen too many officers and enlisted personnel who have those high-end combat awards who were simply in the "right place at the right time" and were just darned lucky that they were able to wear the awards that they earned... but other than those combat valor awards they were pretty much of no consequence after their few brief moments of glory. A sad story, but true... there are some people who do well in combat, but in reality, 99% of a most military careers are made up of the mundane, everyday, "unexciting" work of making either oneself or others ready or able to fight a war.

I personally think that it's a tough call to say whether or not someone has real devotion to duty based on their ribbons. Devotion to duty is in the heart and is in the character of the person... something that can rarely be worn on the chest for all to see.

Just my opinion...

Dave

[Ulsterman]

Tony-

Nice ribbon rack. I reme3mber a time in the USAF when there weren't nearly as many ribbons around. I haven't thought about "tdy" in 25 years.

I would be very grateful if you would, for the sake of medal research and knowledge, expalin how you got each medal.

It would be very interesting and educational.

Thanks,

[tonytdyagain]

I have quite a few friends with Silver Stars, Bronze Stars, Airman's Medals, etc. I was even submitted for a DFC during WW Desert Storm, which was downgraded to an Air Medal; long story, and I can't think of a one of them that was in a situation and was thinking about what kind of medal can I get out of this.

I have also seen REMFs sitting back at base camp writing award packages for crews going out and doing the mission and just so happen to slip their names onto the list. So, shiny bright things don't always show who the valorous types are and who the mission hackers that do the job no matter what they get out of it. I tend to think of myself as one of the kind that gives 100 percent to the mission and get total satisfaction out of mission accomplishment, not what am I getting now.

If I have time, I'll sit down and give a brief synopsis on what I did to get all my bobbles, if I can remember.

[tonytdyagain]

Tony-

Nice ribbon rack. I reme3mber a time in the USAF when there weren't nearly as many ribbons around. I haven't thought about "tdy" in 25 years.

I would be very grateful if you would, for the sake of medal research and knowledge, expalin how you got each medal.

It would be very interesting and educational.

Thanks,

PM Sent

[John R. Angolia]

Good afternoon gentlemen,

I think it time to discuss the background to the question I posed. First, I did not list all the decorations that the individual received, just enough to show a dicotomy.

T/Sgt Glen Wells enlisted in the USAAF on 25 August 1941, being assigned as a Radio Operator/Aerial Gunner in the 338th Squadron, 96th Bomb Group, 8th USAAF. While on a mombing mission over Lorient, France, hiws B-17 (Boot Hill) was shot down. He spent the next three months evading the German Forces with the help of French Resistance. He made his way to Spain, and returned to duty with the 8th AAF. He was discharged on 28 October 1945. His decorations consisted of the Good Conduct, ETO w/one battle star, American Defense, WWII Victory and Air Crew wings. Note that no Air Medal was awarded.

Two months later he re-enlisted in the USMC, being assigned to the 1st Marine Air Wing, Fleet Marine Force. At the outbreak of the Korean War, He volunteered as a radio operator for combat missions flying out of Japan, seeing heavy action over the Chosin Reservoir. For these actions, he received the Air Medal with three gold stars. Some of his other significant awards as a Marine is the Good Conduct with four stars,

and Marine Air Crew wings.

He was discharged from active duty on 1 February 1972.

Gentlemen, the Navy and Marine Corps did not use oak leaf clusters to show subsequent awards, but rather stars.

I have documentation from his personal files to substaniate all that is stated above. The whole purpose of this discourse is to demonstrate that what often appears to be a put-together rack can be very legitmate.

Tony, you are to be congratulated for your service to our country. I had to break out charts to see what some of your many awards were. I'm duly impressed. Jack Angolia

[NavyFCO]

I have documentation from his personal files to substaniate all that is stated above. The whole purpose of this discourse is to demonstrate that what often appears to be a put-together rack can be very legitmate.

Jack-

I appreciate your example, but you kind of "set us up for failure" with the initial list of awards. No where in that list of awards did you mention anything about the National Defense Service Medal, Korean Service Medal or Korea UN. In fact, he should have had two awards of the NDSM, and probably at least a handful of campaigns on the Korean Service.

I could see that he left those off were he just to wear his personal awards, but he put together a rather mish-mash of awards, ranging from personal awards to campaign ribbons.

As I said in my first post, it was either an impossible combination, or it belonged to someone who didn't care about regulations... and it appears that the latter was the case.

Dave

[Mike Page]

This is a 2 star army general I bought over the weekend-@ 1921 I reckon: 2 years overseas and a LOT of awards-especially for those days. Anyone know who he is?

I see that this is an old thread, but anyway I immediately recognized this officer as General Summerall.

http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/books/cg&csa/Summerall-CP.htm

Edited August 12, 2006 by Mike Page

[Laurence Strong]

Hi All and a welcome to Col Angolia

Wonderful thread, I have a brief question. Short of knowing the individuals personal history, is there a way of telling a double MOH winner, is there a cluster on the ribbon or do they were 2 ribbons? Was anyone awarded more than 2 MOH's?

Thanks for your help.

[Jim Baker]

I personally think that it's a tough call to say whether or not someone has real devotion to duty based on their ribbons. Devotion to duty is in the heart and is in the character of the person... something that can rarely be worn on the chest for all to see.

Just my opinion...

Dave

I think this is true in any profession.

[John R. Angolia]

Hello Laurence,

Very good questions! I'll do the best I can. Noone was ever awarded more than two MoH. Off the top of my head, I think at least six persons were awarded two--Thomas Custer, Frank Baldwin, Daniel Daly, John McCloy, Arthur McArthur and Doublas McArthur.

When the actual medals were worn by two-time recipients, both medals would be worn at the same time. As for the designation on the ribbon bar, I can only guess that an oak leaf cluster was affixed to the single ribbon.

Hope this helps. Jack

[Jim Baker]

Laurence,

Here is a double MoH recipient.

Chief John King.

[Ed_Haynes]

Hello Laurence,

Very good questions! I'll do the best I can. Noone was ever awarded more than two MoH. Off the top of my head, I think at least six persons were awarded two--Thomas Custer, Frank Baldwin, Daniel Daly, John McCloy, Arthur McArthur and Doublas McArthur.

When the actual medals were worn by two-time recipients, both medals would be worn at the same time. As for the designation on the ribbon bar, I can only guess that an oak leaf cluster was affixed to the single ribbon.

Hope this helps. Jack

Smedley Butler wore two MoH ribbons. But Smedley did things "his way".

Not the best image (I have a better one some place), but:

Edited August 12, 2006 by Ed_Haynes

[Ed_Haynes]

And:

[Paul R]

I dont understand the order his ribbons are in... The MOH should be the upper right(viewer's left) most position, closest to the heart.

Also... what is the long white bar above the row with the MOH?

[Mike Page]

I dont understand the order his ribbons are in... The MOH should be the upper right(viewer's left) most ribbon, closest to the heart.

Also... what is the long white bar above the row with the MOH?

Actually, those are the MOH's. The one you're speaking of is the Brevet Medal. It's red with white stars.

Confusing, isn't it?

Edited August 12, 2006 by Mike Page

[Jim Baker]

There have been 19 men who have received the Medal of Honor twice. Of these, 5 Marines during WWI received both the Army and the Navy Medal of Honor for the same military action.

I was not aware that D. MacArthur won the medal twice??

[Ed_Haynes]

Yes, the MoH is the entire top row!

[Paul R]

Yes, the MoH is the entire top row!

OMG!! I thought that his MOH was the last ribbon of the second row(with the stars). What is that ribbon then. It would have been too early for the Philippean ribbons.

[Ed_Haynes]

OMG!! I thought that his MOH was the last ribbon of the second row(with the stars). What is that ribbon then. It would have been too early for the Philippean ribbons.

2nd row: Army DSM, Navy DSM, Marine Corps Brevet Medal.

Edited August 12, 2006 by Ed_Haynes

[Mike Page]

I was not aware that D. MacArthur won the medal twice??

Well I know his father received it. Maybe that's what was meant.

[Paul R]

2nd row: Army DSM, Navy DSM, Marine Corps Brevet Medal.

I have just read a couple of articles on the medal. Very interesting. I am still not clear why it was awarded... for officers who were commissioned due to bravery? Very interesting that it was only awarded 20 times between 1861 and 1915.

Here is an article on the medal.

http://www.foxfall.com/fmd-navy-bvt.htm

amd some photos of the medal...

http://www.medals.org.uk/usa/usa017.htm

I have never heard of this medal/distinction before. Being a former Marine, I am kinda shocked!

[Jim Baker]

Here are the doubles:

BALDWIN FRANK D. Army MI GERM. CIVIL WAR/ INDIAN CAMPAIGNS

BUTLER SMEDLEY Marine Corps PA PA VERA CRUZ (1914); HAITI (1915)

COOPER JOHN Navy NY IRELAND CIVIL WAR (BOTH)

CUKELA LOUIS Marine Corps MN AUSTRIA WWI (ARMY & NAVY MEDAL SAME ACTION)

CUSTER THOMAS Army MI OH CIVIL WAR (BOTH)

DALY DANIEL Marine Corps NY NY BOXER REBELLION (1900); HAITI (1915)

HOGAN HENRY Army IRELAND INDIAN CAMPAIGNS (BOTH)

JANSON ERNEST A. Marine Corps NY NY WWI (ARMY & NAVY MEDAL SAME ACTION) AWARDED ARMY MEDAL UNDER NAME OF CHARLES F. HOFFMAN

KELLY JOHN JOSEPH Marine Corps IL IL WWI (ARMY & NAVY MEDAL SAME ACTION)

KING JOHN Navy NY IRELAND INTERIM 1901-1910 (BOTH)

KOCAK MATEJ Marine Corps NY AUSTRIA WWI (ARMY & NAVY MEDAL SAME ACTION)

LAFFERTY JOHN Navy NY IRELAND CIVIL WAR & INTERIM 1871 TO 1898 (aka LAVERTY)

McCLOY JOHN Navy NY NY BOXER REBELLION (1900); VERA CRUZ (1915)

MULLEN PATRICK Navy MD MD CIVIL WAR (BOTH)

PRUITT JOHN HENRY Marine Corps AZ AR WWI (ARMY & NAVY MEDAL SAME ACTION)

SWEENEY ROBERT Navy NJ CANADA INTERIM 1871 - 1898 (BOTH)

WEISBOGEL ALBERT Navy LA LA INTERIM 1871 - 1898 (BOTH)

WILLIAMS LOUIS Navy CA NORWAY INTERIM 1871 - 1898 (BOTH)

WILSON WILLIAM Army PA PA INDIAN CAMPAIGNS (BOTH)