What award it is?

[Noor]

Hi boys and girls!

 

It has been a long time when I came to this forum. College and kids had kept me busy but now I am finished my studies and working again, that mean collecting again as well.

I am seeking help regarding photo attached – on the picture is Robert Nigel Manners Bursnide. He was born 1875 abd he studied in German university. Based on the attached photo, he was an officer as well in the German army. This must be around 1890-1895.

After that he served in South Africa, including Jameson Raider (address given 51 Kerner St, Stuttgard, Germany).

I was wondering does any of the officer lists exist where his name appears as well. Also award that he is wearing has very distinctive shape – perhaps it is possible to confirm his entitlment?

 

Any help about him would be greatly appriciated!

Timo

[dedehansen]

Hi Timo,

I couldn´t find him in the Rangliste from 1914, 1904 and 1897.

There is no entry from him in the Deutscher Ordens Almanach from 08 / 09

I think that it could be a Bavarian Military Merit Order.

Regards
Andreas

[Noor]

Thank you for your replay. He died in South Africa 1898 age 23.

I can get his British South Africa Company medal (only British entitlement) so if I can confirm his German award I think it would be one amazing pair!

 

[Chris Boonzaier]

Oh wow..... I would get that at any price possible!!!

47 minutes ago, dedehansen said:

Hi Timo,

I couldn´t find him in the Rangliste from 1914, 1904 and 1897.

There is no entry from him in the Deutscher Ordens Almanach from 08 / 09

I think that it could be a Bavarian Military Merit Order.

Regards
Andreas

From his age I think it unlikely he served long enough to get one? In fact, because of his age, maybe he just liked dressing up and did not serve in the German army?

OK, he took part in the Jameson raid in 1895 as a simple 20 year old trooper.

If he was a student, where would he have had tme to fit the German military service in?

Jameson would have been crying for leadership people... why would an ex officer not even have had NCO rank and only been a trooper?

No way he would have had a German award looking anything like that.

I am guessing a young student who joined the Jameson raid as a simple trooper.

I am going to go for this either being Burnside in fancy dress, or it not being him ?

[Noor]

Photo was provided by the family. Yes, I fully agree - there are plenty of oddities and also because my focus is back to R.Dub.Fus. I want to be sure about his entitlement before I get his British award. If the story do not match up I think I will just pass then.

Sorry, my typo - BURNSIDE was his family name indeed.

[Glenn J]

Timo,

I think we can safely assume that this is not Robert Burnside. This chap very much appears to be a Leutnant in Grenadier-Regiment Nr, 119 and no officer of that name, either active or reserve served in the Württemberg Army Corps during the period 1894-1898 (or Prussian, Bavarian or Saxon Armies for that matter). Or as Chris says, Burnside in fancy dress.

Regards

Glenn

[Noor]

Thank you very much for your replies guys!

[Noor]

Information from the Burnside family - apparently the photograph is not of Robert Nigel Manners Burnside but of his brother in law William Farmer. The family had the photos mixed up. William Farmer was also English and lived in Stuttgart at the same time as the Robert Burnside family. He eventually married Burnside's sister, which is why the family have both of their pictures and how they got mixed up. Apologies for this.

[ixhs]

119 "O" rules

One of my favourite regiment as Württemberger.

 

The Kernerstaße is still existing. A nice street with old houses.

Edited February 10, 2016 by ixhs

[Glenn J]

Timo,

sadly, I think the family are misinformed. Just like Mr. Burnside, there are no commissioned officers in the Prussian or Württemberg armies with the name Farmer in this time frame. I have checked from 1889 to 1914.

Regards

Glenn

[HeikoGrusdat]

But there are officers in IR119 with only a Bavarian MVO on the breast....for example Freiherr von Lützow in 1899....but now we come to total guessing