EK 1870 1914, 1870, 1945....

[Chris Boonzaier]

As a soldier serving at the time.... which was the "easiest" EK2 to win.... taking into account the "Inflation" of WW1 EKs.

[coastie]

As a soldier serving at the time.... which was the "easiest" EK2 to win.... taking into account the "Inflation" of WW1 EKs.

I would say the 1914 EK2 They would probably give you one for just showing up to muster.

[gregM]

I have been under the assumption that by the end of ww2. The TR was handing out EK2s like

handing out candy on Holloween.

Edited March 21, 2006 by gregM

[dond]

I have been under the assumption that by the end of ww2. The TR was handing out EK2s like

handing out candy on Holloween.

I agree. As the disaster happens it is SOP to toss out awards.

Don

[Dave Danner]

I think in both World Wars, and for that matter in other conflicts and other nations, you see a sort of reverse bell curve.

In the initial stages, a large number of awards are given out. There is a novelty to it (especially with the Iron Cross, with the big gap in years from the previous time awards were made) and there is also no perception of how long the conflict will go on.

As it sinks in that the conflict will not be over soon, the award criteria are tightened, to prevent watering down. As the war progresses and morale sinks, though, the desire to use these baubles to increase morale increases, and more awards are made.

Thus, something that got you an Iron Cross in the Polish or Western campaigns of 1939-40 might have gotten nothing in 1941-2, while something barely considered worthy of a pat on the back in 1939-40 would have led to an Iron Cross in 1944-45.

[Les]

As a soldier serving at the time.... which was the "easiest" EK2 to win.... taking into account the "Inflation" of WW1 EKs.

Chris, there's also the enlisted versus officer consideration. An enlisted man or "commoner" coming from a working class type background usually had to do "something" to get decorated early in any of Germany's (the same can probably be said for almost any other European country with a class system), whereas officers coming from a middle or upper-class background might get medals for very different reasons other than personal bravery or "leadership." Social status often resulted in officers with a "von" getting an award, for reasons that at times appear to be little more than saying "thanks for being there, even if you didn't do anything" and something they could wear in front of family and friends. The soldiers and officers in the thick of things usually knew who "earned" something the hard way.

The EK's weren't the only medals to be awarded for "being there" during the later part of WWI and WWII. Look at the statistics for the numbers of RK's given out during WWII by year, and during WWI, the same thing happened with the GMVK and PlM.

During the first part of WWI, the PlM was usually awarded for successful actions -against- (meaning offensive combat in which objectives were taken) an enemy. For example, Rommels' actions in Italy during 1917 and his capture of a mountain peak or two, and thousands of Italian troops in the process is an outstanding example of an officer who displayed personal initiative and did more than he was expected. By the middle of 1918, when the German spring/summer offensives had failed and German forces were clearly on the defensive and losing ground, the number of awarded PlMs and GMVKs were on the increase. During the summer of 1918, instead of receiving medals for offensive actions against enemies at the front, German soliders and officers were starting to increasingly be awarded medals for -defensive- actions and what amounted to holding the line..

For most of the war (1914-1917), the soldiers (and officers leading them) were expected to do more than hold the line, because traditional military thinking is that wars are not usually won by remaining on the defensive. By 1918 (and similarly in late 1944/45) being able to hold the line was becoming the best that could be expected.

Les

[Daniel Murphy]

The reason so many EK 2s were awarded in WW1 is because for every soldier who died, an Iron Cross was "awarded" to the deceased and sent to the next of kin. In the renewal document, it states that "For every sacrifice in the war an Iron Cross will be given". This accounts for about 2 million of the over 5 million awarded. So... technically, all one had to do was get killed to receive one. Some might call that easy, unless you are the one doing the dying. You would never get to wear it of course, because you are dead. But, your family could frame it or put it under a glass dome to remember you by.

Dan Murphy

[Chris Boonzaier]

The reason so many EK 2s were awarded in WW1 is because for every soldier who died, an Iron Cross was "awarded" to the deceased and sent to the next of kin. In the renewal document, it states that "For every sacrifice in the war an Iron Cross will be given". This accounts for about 2 million of the over 5 million awarded. So... technically, all one had to do was get killed to receive one. Some might call that easy, unless you are the one doing the dying. You would never get to wear it of course, because you are dead. But, your family could frame it or put it under a glass dome to remember you by.

Dan Murphy

I am not so sure of this. There would technically have to be some kind of award documents for these?

My understanding is the large death certificates were the visable gratitude of the nation. One step cheaper than the british with their "death penny" and document.

I have never, ever seen an award document or Milit?rpass entry for a Posthumous EK?

[Chris Boonzaier]

Hi Dan,

Do you have the exact relevant passage? I am looking for it but cannot find it.

An automatic award to the dead I can find no trace of. I do however have numerous groups where men who were invalided out were awarded the EK after their discharge.

best

Chris

[Daniel Murphy]

Chris,

As quoted in "The Iron Time" by Stephen Previtera on page 159.

"The Iron Cross is to be awarded without exception to all persons of the Army, Navy and Home Guard, members of volunteer nursing units and to all other persons who offer their service to the Army or Navy or who are designated as Army or Navy officers. The award will be given for every sacrifice made during the war. Further, all persons who earn it by serving the needs of the German Empire and it's allies at home may receive the cross"

Surely the Kaiser was not speaking of economic sacrifices, everyone made THEM. The wording is also very specific. It does not say "may be given" or "is to be awarded", it states "will be given". To my knowledge, there was no document or entry into the deceased's pay book. It would have been sent to the next of kin with a letter, or with the death cetificate. In WW2 the family was sent a Gold Wound Badge. There was no such thing as a wound badge in 1914.

Dan Murphy

[Ed_Haynes]

Chris,

As quoted in "The Iron Time" by Stephen Previtera on page 159.

"The Iron Cross is to be awarded without exception to all persons of the Army, Navy and Home Guard, members of volunteer nursing units and to all other persons who offer their service to the Army or Navy or who are designated as Army or Navy officers. The award will be given for every sacrifice made during the war. Further, all persons who earn it by serving the needs of the German Empire and it's allies at home may receive the cross"

Is this Perevitera speaking or is he quoting an original source? If so, what is that? This can always be a problem when normal citation form is abandoned. I won't characterise this practice further.

As I always try to teach my students, quoting a secondary source means comparatively little, only quoting a primary source is valid and valuable. They rarely learn this (either).

[Guest Rick Research]

I have the refoundation text in German.

It can be laboriously retyped, but

this is a COMPLETE MISUNDERSTANDING of the paraphrased original German text.

German awards were not made posthumously except in extremely unusual circumstances.

There were never automatic posthumous Iron Crosses. Ever.

[Ed_Haynes]

I have the refoundation text in German.

It can be laboriously retyped, but

this is a COMPLETE MISUNDERSTANDING of the paraphrased original German text.

German awards were not made posthumously except in extremely unusual circumstances.

There were never automatic posthumous Iron Crosses. Ever.

Thank you Rick. No need to retype. We take your word for it.

[Guest Rick Research]

MY translation of the re-foundation decree and wartime amendments. I hope that Glenn will post scans of the A.K.O. text in German from the A.V.B. or M.W.B. and save my fingies from turning into stubs.

5 August 1914:

"We, Wilhelm, by the grace of God King of Prussia etc etc

Considering the gravity of the situation in which the dear Fatherland has been placed by a war forced upon it, and in thankful remembrance of the heroic deeds of our forefathers in the great years of the War of Liberation and the struggle for the unification of Germany,

We will once again revive the decoration of the Iron Cross instituted by our resting-in-God great-grandfather.

The Iron Cross shall be awarded without distinction of rank or status on members of the army, the navy, and the Landsturm, on members of the voluntary medical care bodies, and on such persons who hold a service obligation with the army or navy, as a reward for merit in the theater of operations. Further, such persons at home who earn merit in the welfare of the German armed forces and that of its allies, shall receive the Cross.

Therefore We decree the following:

1) The revived decoration of the Iron Cross shall, as previously, consist of two classes and a Grand Cross. The decoration and the ribbon remains unchanged, except that on the obverse under the W with the crown the year 1914 will be placed.

2) The Second Class will be worn in the buttonhole from a black ribbon with white edges, inasmuch as it is awarded for merit in the theater of operations. For merit earned at home, it will be awarded on a white ribbon with black edges. The First Class will be worn on the left breast and the Grand Cross around the neck.

3) The First Class can only be earned after the Second has been awarded, and will be worn below that.

4) The bestowal of the Grand Cross is only awarded conditional upon prior award of the First and Second Classes. It can only result for a crucial victorious battle, in which the enemy is thrown out of his positions, or for the independent leadership of an Army or Fleet crowned with success, or for the capture of a great fortress, or for the holding of a significant fortress through a prolonged defense.

5) Everyone in possession of the Military Decoration First and Second Classes' associated privileges dependent on the constitutional regulation of an honorary pay increase, give up to the Iron Cross First and Second Class. {{{No, I can't figure out what this section MEANS, either. Bureaucratese. But there WAS no pay supplement for Iron Cross possession, unlike these earlier decorations. RR}}}

In proof of which, under Our Highest Signature and attached Royal Seal,

Given at Berlin on the 5th of August 1914

(signed) Wilhelm."

That was amended at Supreme Headquarters on 16 March 1915 to add:

"In extension and amendment of the renewal decree, the King has further decreed:

1) The Iron Cross shall, in appropriate cases, also be awarded to members of the allied forces.

2) To Paragraph 2 of the decree of 5th August 1914 the following clarification:

The Second Class will be worn in the buttonhole on a black ribbon with white edges, inasmuch as it is awarded for merit in the theater of operations. For merit earned at home, awarded on a white ribbon with black edges, insofar as it was not on grounds of special military merit on the black ribbon with white edges. The First Class will be worn on the left breast. The Grand Cross around the neck."

These UNCLEAR "clarifications were amended again at Supreme Headquarters on 4 June 1915:

"In order to avoid holders of the 1870 Iron Cross wearing two of the same crosses, in the present war (for merit earned in the theater of operations or special merit in the homeland), receive as a distinction a silver bar which bears a miniature Iron Cross with the year 1914, to be worn on the ribbon of the [1870] Iron Cross above the silver [1895 jubilee] oakleaves."

And that, folks, is the ENTIRE official statutory text during the war. I have not scanned my 1920 German source for the text above, since anyone who doubts like Thomas needs to see the official government-printed versions from 1914 and 1915. Notice that there is absolutely NO use at any point of the word "sacrifice" in the German original. This is an off the top of my head but LITERAL translation above. "Earned merit" could certainly be translated as "merit displayed" etc etc but I stray as little as possible from the style and direct specifics of the words used.

[Daniel Murphy]

Rick,

If I remember correctly this wrong translation was also used in another EK book as well. Thank you for clearing this up. Things can indeed get lost in the translation.

Dan Murphy

[Chris Boonzaier]

am finishing up an article on this subject, wanted to se if there were any further thoughts?