paja Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) Some of us noticed a large amount of "shinny" IKOM orders flooding the market, I think it's about time to start a separate topic about this matter. The list includes the following decorations: -Partisan Star 3rd Class -Partisan Star 2nd Class -Order of Brotherhood and Unity 2nd Class -Order of Brotherhood and Unity 1st Class -Order of Merits for the People 3rd Class -Order of Merits for the People 2nd Class -Order of Labor 2nd Class I would also add one higher decoration to this list - Order of National Liberation! All these orders have a few things in common. They are early IKOM "screw" decorations which look brand spanking new, at least to me, even though they should be from the forties and/or the fifties. I'll post a few examples of every decoration from the list, since the Partisan Star 3rd class is the first I'll go from there. I don't know if these were being awarded at all, I have never seen IKOM made Partisan Star with an awarding certificate of any kind, let alone with a matching number. They are hallmarked (IKOM and rooster) and numbered (20K-29K). Couple of orders I already posted in the Yugoslavian Partisan Stars topic, notice the rifles on these two. Edited October 31, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 The rest of the photos I posted in the above mentioned topic, these are some of the ones I really dislike, there are nicer examples. First star doesn't have "rooster" hallmark but it has a "double vision" number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) Wider screw nuts comparison. Up - Partisan Stars, down - IKOM screw nuts of the following decorations from my collection which I consider 100% authentic: -Brotherhood & Unity II -Merits for the People II -Merits for the People III -Partisan Commemorative Medal 1941 Edited October 31, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) Here's one more unusual detail which can be seen on some of the stars. Edited October 31, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Gaumann Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Here's my shiny PS3. It's being discussed on the PS thread but it helped ignite discussion about what we're thinking may be much more recent emissions or strikes. And here's an image of the same awards with arrows point to what I consider excessive filing or saw marks as initially noted above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 Thank you for your contribution to this matter! For those who didn't follow our discussion in the Partisan Star topic, Eric was kind enough to test his star for silver content. Hopefully results will answer some of the questions we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 Partisan Star 2nd Class Up until the last year IKOM made 2nd classes were extremely rare and then all of the sudden they started flooding the market. As the time goes by their number is increasing, I noticed five stars this month alone. All of them are hallmarked (IKOM and rooster) and numbered (so far 78XX-81XX). They also look new and shinny and have those ugly wider screw nuts. Here are couple of photos of the first one I noticed, it got sold over Serbian internet auction site for nearly 500 euros and then ended up on ebay. Nowadays you can easily get them for around 80 euros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 This is the only one I remember from before, front side more or less the same, back side - a different story. Photos found HERE. So far I saw only couple of 1st class stars and they were also unnumbered, on the other hand I don't remember seeing unnumbered 3rd class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kallarati Heroik Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Hello Paja. In the title you must specify for Yugoslavian orders. Because IKOM-ZAGREB praduced orders for many states (include Albania). Regards my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 Side by side. Different surface on the back side, different Roman numeral, one numbered and hallmarked, other one not. Apart from all that looks like the left one had narrower screw nut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 16 minutes ago, Kallarati Heroik said: Hello Paja. In the title you must specify for Yugoslavian orders. Because IKOM-ZAGREB praduced orders for many states (include Albania). Regards my friend. Title renamed, thanks for the suggestion. Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalkanCollector Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) Thanks for creating this topic Paja! I hope we will find some answers. Here's my shinny IKOM Partisan Star 3rd class which I've already shown here: http://gmic.co.uk/topic/15023-yugoslavian-partisan-stars/?page=11 post #258 It has an unusual details which both Paja and Eric pointed out. Edited November 1, 2017 by BalkanCollector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 Thank you for posting photos of the order from your collection. Take a look at 2nd and 1st class from Sammler's base, you can't see that detail on the front side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 On the other hand most of the numbered 2nd classes have that front side flaw. It's clearly visible on this particular example, on some of the others not as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalkanCollector Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 34 minutes ago, paja said: Thank you for posting photos of the order from your collection. Take a look at 2nd and 1st class from Sammler's base, you can't see that detail on the front side. I don't like these at all. The 2nd class' screw pin looks like it isn't in center at all. The 1st class' wreath is way too thin. 16 minutes ago, paja said: On the other hand most of the numbered 2nd classes have that front side flaw. It's clearly visible on this particular example, on some of the others not as much. Maybe those are actually mint flaws which were common for this order... Talking about shinny, I have this documented group of Order of Labour with Golden Wreath and Order of Merits for the People with Silver Rays awarded to the single person which I think it's 100% authentic. Is it just me or does it have that shinny too good to be true look although I think it's legit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, BalkanCollector said: I don't like these at all. The 2nd class' screw pin looks like it isn't in center at all. The 1st class' wreath is way too thin. Maybe those are actually mint flaws which were common for this order... I think you're right about the 2nd class' screw not being centered. I've only seen two or three IKOM made 1st classes and they also looked like that. Perhaps, but then again it's unusual to see so many flawed decorations coming out of IKOM, especially those uneven edges on the back side. 1 hour ago, BalkanCollector said: Talking about shinny, I have this documented group of Order of Labour with Golden Wreath and Order of Merits for the People with Silver Rays awarded to the single person which I think it's 100% authentic. Is it just me or does it have that shinny too good to be true look although I think it's legit? Everything looks authentic to me as well. First of all these are not made out of silver, but even some non precious metals and alloys catch patina and I believe you can see some of it on the back side of the Labor Order and the front side of the Merits for the People. I think someone cleaned them up a bit at some point, especially the Labor Order. I had one 3rd class like that, front side shinny, back side patinated, so what happened? I believe someone cleaned it up and then back side being in contact with that synthetic material inside the box patinated faster. If you take a look at the double needle Labor Order (2nd and 3rd class) which was the last type (not that remade variant), you can see that most of them shine, but I don't think there's anything wrong with them. Silver was not used for their production, I'm pretty sure they aren't silvered and I always had a feeling they applied a thin layer of some kind of lacquer over them. Edited November 1, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalkanCollector Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Thanks for the further explanation! Any chance you can share the photos of those three IKOM 1st classes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 8 minutes ago, BalkanCollector said: Any chance you can share the photos of those three IKOM 1st classes? PM sent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) Here's one more 2nd class Partisan Star and then I'll move to the Brotherhood & Unity order. Photos are from ebay, it got sold last month for 193$. Seller's description: "Made from silver. IKOM ZAGREB mint, never seen."LINK This one is pretty much the same as the previous one, high number (8K), two hallmarks (IKOM and rooster), front side flaws... Edited November 1, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) I know I said I'll move to the Brotherhood and Unity Order but take a look at this one I just noticed. Judging by the photos and especially background I'm pretty sure the seller is the same. On top of everything this one has hand-engraved number. Edited November 1, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalkanCollector Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 That's really weird. I've never seen any Yugoslav decoration hand engraved. Also, does it look like it only has IKOM stamp or am I missing the rooster somewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 1, 2017 Author Share Posted November 1, 2017 Me neither, number on Yugoslav made orders were imprinted not hand engraved. I think you're right, I don't see rooster hallmark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Gaumann Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 4 hours ago, BalkanCollector said: hand engraved. The more correct term would be 'rotating tool engraved'. I think the Mondvor site uses that term for the late-era Soviet awards engraved in that manner. Apologies for being pedantic. It's easier to differentiate between the two styles. 8 hours ago, BalkanCollector said: Is it just me or does it have that shinny too good to be true look although I think it's legit? I'm sure it's fine. Your right side order shows what I always assumed to be some sort of lacquer that was applied to a lot of later Yugo awards and contributes to some 'shineyness'. You lacquer has failed in a few spots and some patina has started to develop. At least that's my theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 2, 2017 Author Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) 17 hours ago, Eric Gaumann said: The more correct term would be 'rotating tool engraved'. I think the Mondvor site uses that term for the late-era Soviet awards engraved in that manner. Apologies for being pedantic. It's easier to differentiate between the two styles. Thanks for clarification, no need to apologize. According to Rudež, after the war IKOM made unnumbered Partisan Stars with screw and his book remains the main source of information about Yugoslav decorations to this day. Stojan Rudež was the chief of the Chancellery of Orders for some time during the eighties. Based on his signatures on the awarding certificates I'm guessing from 1983 until 1984. Edited November 2, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paja Posted November 2, 2017 Author Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) Order of Brotherhood and Unity 2nd Class High numbers (30K-60K), hallmarked (IKOM and rooster), mainly those ugly wider screw nuts. Edited November 2, 2017 by paja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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