Regimental histories...

[Chris Boonzaier]

... I have well over a hundred on CD, but Murphys law applies... you never have the ones you need....

Does anyone have the 6th Field Artillery Regt history?

Thanks

Chris

[Chris Boonzaier]

Anyone know if one was published?

Thanks

Chris

[Dave Danner]

6th Bavarian or Prussian?

[Dave Danner]

Geschichte des Feldartillerie-Regiments von Peucker (1. Schles.) Nr. 6, 1914-1918; bearbeitet vom Offizier- und Kameradenverein des ehem. Feldartillerie-Regiments von Peucker (1. Schles.) Nr. 6., Breslau, Ostdeutsche Verlagsanstalt, 1932.

I can get the FAR 6 history tomorrow when I go to the library.

Die Geschichte des K. B. 6. Feldartillerie-Regiments, Prinz Ferdinand von Bourbon, Herzog von Calabrien; nach den amtlichen Kriegstageb?chern und privaten Aufzeichnungen der Kameraden., Zeulenroda, Th?ringen, B. Sporn, 1931.

It has been digitized in the Google Books project, but isn't downloadable or readable online. But I think I can order an electronic copy of it from the source.

Edited May 30, 2007 by Dave Danner

[Chris Boonzaier]

Hi,

It is the Prussian one. I am trying to find any pictures/info on the following....

officer commanding 9th Battery, 3rd Abteilung FAR 6: Hauptmann Jonkheer de Casembroot (in June 1916 commanding 6th Battery, 2nd Abteilung on the Somme.

I am more of a document guy, but have the following named tunic...

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=16624

If you could find anything I would be very greatful.

Thanks

Chris

[Dave Danner]

Hi,

It is the Prussian one. I am trying to find any pictures/info on the following....

officer commanding 9th Battery, 3rd Abteilung FAR 6: Hauptmann Jonkheer de Casembroot (in June 1916 commanding 6th Battery, 2nd Abteilung on the Somme.

I am more of a document guy, but have the following named tunic...

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=16624

If you could find anything I would be very greatful.

Thanks

Chris

I will see what I can find. If there are photos, I'll have to make a photocopy there and then scan it at home, since it is not a lending library, so the quality might not be the best.

By the way, I made a copy today of Die Ritter des Eisernen Kreuzes in alphabetischer Reihenfolge, Band 1, published some time in 1915, which has all EK1s and EK2s up to that date. Unfortunately, they only had Band 1, so it has all the EK1s but only EK2s through the letter K.

[Chris Boonzaier]

By the way, I made a copy today of Die Ritter des Eisernen Kreuzes in alphabetischer Reihenfolge, Band 1, published some time in 1915, which has all EK1s and EK2s up to that date. Unfortunately, they only had Band 1, so it has all the EK1s but only EK2s through the letter K.

Hi,

Does it have any citations? I have never seen this book and have no idea what kind of format it has, (what info etc).

best

Chris

[bob lembke]

By the way, I made a copy today of Die Ritter des Eisernen Kreuzes in alphabetischer Reihenfolge, Band 1, published some time in 1915, which has all EK1s and EK2s up to that date. Unfortunately, they only had Band 1, so it has all the EK1s but only EK2s through the letter K.

Remarkable. Never heard of such a publication. You are brave indeed to mention that you have such a publication.

Possibly you could do me a great favor. Family oral history (amazingly, proven remarkably reliable) and some additional evidence indicates that my grand-father, Feuerwerk=Hauptmann Heinrich Fuchs, who was the Id of the Generalkommando of III. Reservekorps, was awarded the EK II and the EK I within about two months of his arrival in Belgium, upon the capture of Antwerp. The corps commander, General von Beseler, was awarded the OPLM at that time.

Could you kindly look him up in the volume that you foolishly mentioned, and give me any particulars that might be mentioned, such as the date of these awards? Better yet, could you possibly scan the page(s) that mention these supposed awards? (I can PM you my e-mail address.) I hope to (and have started) to write up his remarkable life.

As for my father, he was a very naughty Flamm=Pionier, and therefore he only got his EK II in 1921 from the Ministry of War (I have the medal and, more importantly, his award document), although he saw considerable action, mostly at Verdun in 1916 and Reims in 1918. (He spent about 18 months in various hospitals and in depot, due to his worst wound, at Verdun in December 1916.) He also never even was promoted to Gefreiter, although he led a Flamm=Trupp. His greatest misdeed was to shoot and kill his company CO, who was a drunk, a thief, and a serious coward. He and his fellow shooters actually got away with it, in a complicated manner. (The whole company command structure was corrupt, and he hated it.) He also was able to shoot a sergeant in the butt, and get away with it, and kick another in the face from above with the sole of his boot, the hob-nails seriously modifying it, and getting the sergeant put up on discipline for having been kicked. He also was a sort of Milo Milobinder-type company entreprenuer, had a big mouth, was educated, spoke six languages, and his father was a staff officer. (His one visit to his son was a publicity disaster for the latter; the whole company had to be called out in formation, etc., and he suffered retaliation.) So, although being wounded four times in combat, the only decoration he got during the war was a black wound badge.

So we need not look for him. No Ritter he.

Many thanks.

Bob Lembke

[Ulsterman]

OMG!!!!!

Now THAT is THE book to find! Makes you wonder about Band 2 and 3...?

Is this the NYC city library perchance?

Dave, I would be very grateful and willing to offer large bribes etc. to get a copy of that book.

Let me know if I can and who i have to kill or bribe in order to do so.

Ta,

Ulster

[bob lembke]

Now THAT is THE book to find! Makes you wonder about Band 2 and 3...?

My question also. But I suspect that the publication of this petered out as the war ground on, certainly as the EK II is concerned.

Is this the NYC city library perchance?

I wrote a longer version of my above post, and I went on a bit about the NYPL. But my post flew off to some cyber black hole. The New York Public Library is one of the great libraries of the world. And, as the name implies, it is basically a private library, at least originally, and in part today. (Sort of like Brit "public schools".) It was formed in 1911, I believe, by the likes of Andrew Carnegie, the Vanderbilts, and the Astors. It was a library for the public, not a public institution. I have not been in the door in 40 years, as I live elsewhere, but every year (when I remember) I send them a check to support this wonderful institution.

It now has actual public, lending branches and divisions, but the core research library is private and does not lend books. When I worked on the Mexican War (1845-48) ages ago, when you used some of the rarer material you were locked in a wire cage with the book in question.

Ta,

Ulster

Bob Lembke

[Dave Danner]

The book is on microfilm, and I had to print out every page with a little dark smudge due to dirt on the lens. But while it is in really tiny type, it is legible.

It does not give dates. The cover page, shown below, is dated by the publisher as December 1914.

[Dave Danner]

Here is an example from one of the two sections of EK1 awards. Band 1 was divided into Hefte 1 and 2. Both Hefte had EK1s from A to Z, while Heft 1 had EK2s from A to F and Heft 2 from G to K. I assume there was a Band 2 which had more EK1s and EK2 from L to Z, but who knows where copies of it are? The NYPL doesn't have it. I Googled the name of the publication and found nothing.

[Dave Danner]

Bob, I don't see a Hptm. Heinrich Fuchs on this list. Here are the EK2s for Fuchs:

[Dave Danner]

The rest of the Fuchs below. The only EK1 Fuchs listed was the one from IR 158.

[bob lembke]

Dave;

Why don't you post whatever citation information you have, like who published it, any dates, etc. I have several good shots at finding them, if possible. You well may have some of my tools, but certainly not all.

I myself poke about in the catalogs of major European libraries a lot, especiallty the Deutsches Buecherei Leipzig, to best German library for pre-1945 material. I had a very good working relationship with the director of research there, but she recently retired, I think, but I have contact with her successor. She warned me that not all of their older material is cataloged on-line, but they have a special paper catalog for WW I material.

My "ace in the hole" is my spousal unit, who is the principal foreign language aquisitions librarian for one of the major US libraries. She has resources that are not available to ordinary mortals, I believe, not one but possibly at least two "world catalogs", and another catalog that covers the libraries of Germany, Switzerland, and half of Austria. These I believe are pay to use tools sold to libraries. She can work effectively in dozens of languages, so she is "Ace, Book Detective" extraordinaire.

If the sample you posted is what this publication would have on my grand-father, it would not actually add more info, although it would be nice to have confirmation of his receiving these awards. I have found confirmation in a 1500 page most obscure book on Feuerwerk=Offiziere that one of our most illustrious Pals posseses in Europe, that lists which of those officers got the EK I. The book also contains an article that grand-father wrote about his most significant exploit in the war.

Bob Lembke

[bob lembke]

Dave;

You posted the scans while I wrote one of my overly long posts.

I have the scan of the page of the book that I mentioned, and I have a photo of the Generalkommando in Belgium, 18 of which seem to be wearing their new EK I and EK II, while von Beseler is showing off his OPLM. But the photo cannot definitively show that the set of two medals so many got were certainly those two medals. The Kaiser was delighted when III. RK beat up about 150,000 Belgians and Brits and took the third largest fortress complex in the world.

Perhaps the book you copied is not complete, or later Baenden completed the lists.

Bob Lembke

[Ulsterman]

OMG! OMG!!

This is THE BEST news in years!! I am agog!

[Glenn J]

Bob,

Feuerwerks-Hauptmann d.L. Fuch's award of an EK2 is also confirmed in the Kriegs-Rangliste der s?mtlichen Offiziere im Bereiche der Feldzeugmeisterei as at 1 February 1916. That being the case his EK1 presumably came later?

Regards

Glenn

[bob lembke]

Bob,

Feuerwerks-Hauptmann d.L. Fuch's award of an EK2 is also confirmed in the Kriegs-Rangliste der s?mtlichen Offiziere im Bereiche der Feldzeugmeisterei as at 1 February 1916. That being the case his EK1 presumably came later?

Regards

Glenn

"Speaking of: "one of our most illustrious Pals"! I have a letter from g-f to my father, dated just after Antwerp fell, saying that, paraphrasing from memory: "I just had dinner with a high gentleman, and he confided that we are to get a high decoration." As he was the Id, I think that the "high gentleman" was either the Ia, who he reported to, possibly the AK chief of staff, or possibly the guy on the bureaucratic side that he reported to. As you know, the Id uniquely reported to both sides of the Generalkommando. Or, slight possibility, von Beseler himself.

Also, I have a picture of the Generalkommando standing on the steps of the City Hall in Ghent, I believe, 18 men displaying new pairs of medals hanging from the button-hole, von Beseler the OPLM, all looking quite pleased. The Kaiser telegraphed an enthusiastic congrats when Antwerp fell, and he probably ordered the mass decoration, I would guess.

So g-f and the other officers physically got their medals in the fall of 1914, at least physically. I don't know a lot about the bureaucratics of awarding medals.

Just now looked up my translation of the letter, which was dated September 30, 1914. (The above was from memory): " Yesterday evening I was with a gentleman that reports to the commanding general, and to our ???????? he has presented everyone the Iron Cross. "

As to the ?????, I translated the letter just after I started to teach myself German, I have to run at the letters again. I do see that my memory embellished the letter a bit. I think I transposed the "high decoration" from a statement of a Oberleutnant of my father's flame regiment, Theune, describing an award for a successful flame attack that he led at Verdun, where he used that phrase. I have not read the letter for 4-5 years, probably.

I also understand that the Germans took Ghent on October 12, 1914. As I said, the picture in Ghent shows happy officers, many sporting new identical pairs of medals.

Any opinions on this will be gratefully received.

Bob Lembke

[Dave Danner]

Hi,

It is the Prussian one. I am trying to find any pictures/info on the following....

officer commanding 9th Battery, 3rd Abteilung FAR 6: Hauptmann Jonkheer de Casembroot (in June 1916 commanding 6th Battery, 2nd Abteilung on the Somme.

I am more of a document guy, but have the following named tunic...

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=16624

If you could find anything I would be very greatful.

Thanks

Chris

First the bad news: no pictures. The only officers pictured in the book were the regimental commanders and Abteilung commanders, and not even all of them.

The good news: there were more than a few mentions of Jonkheer de Casembroot thoughout.

In the regimental Kriegsrangliste of 1.8.14, he is a Lt. and Adjutant of II. Abteilung. On 26.2.15, the then Oblt. Jonkheer de Casembroot became Batterie-F?hrer of 5./FAR 6 due to the illness of its commander, Hptm. d.R. Winzek. Hptm. d.R. Wintzek returned to duty on 6.5.15, and apparently Oblt. Jonkheer de Casembroot returned to the Abteilung staff. Two months later, in July, Winzek became the commander of II./FAR 6 when Maj. Amelung, who had commanded the Abteilung since the war began, became commander of Landwehr-Feldartillerie-Regiment Nr. 15.

This was during the Stellungskampf in the Artois region. The situation before the southern sector of the 11. Infanterie-Division was relatively quiet, when a shell hit the command post of the 6.Batterie on 3 August 1915. Batterie-Offizier Lt.d.R. Otto's jugular was sliced and he was killed instantly, while Batterie-F?hrer Lt. d.R. Bobisch, struck in the lower body, took two days to die.

6./FAR 6 was placed temporarily under the command of Lt. Bogatsch, the Adjutant of I.Abteilung, but he was replaced on 5. August 1915 by Oblt. Jonkheer de Casembroot, and Bogatsch replaced him as II. Abteilung Adjutant.

As you already know, he was still in command of 6. Batterie during the Battle of the Somme. His battery was part of the 11. Infanterie-Division's Nordgruppe, a mixed group of heavy and lighter artillery in the northern sector of the divisional front. They were set up in a small wood called Fuchsbauw?ldchen (foxhole copse), 900 meters northwest of Belloy with an OP (B.St.) in Fay. There are several Belloys in the Somme region, but I think this one is Belloy-en-Santerre.

The British artillery preparation began on 23 June. The sector also faced French air attacks, especially on the artillery's observation balloons. On 1 July, they were under heavy attack and the OP was pulled back. Late in the evening, infantry reserves arrived to consolidate the line. Oblt. Jonkheer de Casembroot personally led the infantry ahead to their positions, and was seriously wounded. So his Battle of the Somme ended fairly quickly on that first day, though unlike almost 20,000 British soldiers on the bloodiest day in British history, he survived.

Jonkheer de Casembroot then disappears from the regimental history until 9 January 1917, when the new III. Abteilung was stood up and he took command of 9. Batterie. He was still an Oberleutnant.

He doesn't show up again until the Third Battle of Ypres. 9./FAR 6 was the regiment's mobile reserve. Now-Hptm. Jonkheer de Casembroot's battery distinguished itself in defense against British attacks on 31 July and in support of the counterattacks of the "Eingreifdivisionen" (50. Res.Div. and 221. Inf.Div.). There is also a description of his battery in infantry support and anti-tank actions, but the pages I copied don't have dates and I can't remember exactly when this was. It was during the Ypres/Passchendaele battles, though.

He is still commanding 9./FAR 6 on the 1.4.18 Kriegsrangliste of the regiment, but he is not on the 1.10.18 Kriegsrangliste. I couldn't find a mention in the text of him leaving the regiment.

[Glenn J]

Bob,

a couple of thoughts:

in 1914 I would imagine the EK2 was still a very prestigious award.

The EK2 when newly presented was worn suspended from its ribbon in the second buttonhole.

Regards

Glenn

[Chris Boonzaier]

Hi Dave,

That is superb! especially the infantry support bit for the 50th (and 221) ID.

That gives me something to go on indeed as info on 3rd Ypres and the Somme are there to find.

The anti tank role is very nice as well.

I guess my jacket was being tailored while he was in Ypres, so was not worn during the fighting, but i love it all the same.

Thanks for the efforts

All the best

Chris

[Dave Danner]

Hi Dave,

That is superb! especially the infantry support bit for the 50th (and 221) ID.

That gives me something to go on indeed as info on 3rd Ypres and the Somme are there to find.

The anti tank role is very nice as well.

I guess my jacket was being tailored while he was in Ypres, so was not worn during the fighting, but i love it all the same.

Thanks for the efforts

All the best

Chris

I can send you the copies of the pages I copied. It might be cheaper to PDF them and e-mail them to you, though. Do you have an Adobe PDF reader?

[webr55]

I have looked it up, but German library catalogs also have only vol. 1, with a notice that no more volumes appeared.

[Chris Boonzaier]

I can send you the copies of the pages I copied. It might be cheaper to PDF them and e-mail them to you, though. Do you have an Adobe PDF reader?

Hi,

lets try the PDF way, I think that should work.

Once again, thanks for the efforts.

Chris