kasle

Enamelled minis are more common than enamelled full size EKs, but still harder to find ones. Nice pin!

Hi, I would like to know your opinions about this Bavarian Sport-Leistungs Abzeichen in Silver. Dimensions cca 30 x 40 mm. Is it 1st version (Fassung) awarded only between 1949 -51, as I suppose? Thank you in advance for any info.

Hello Elmar, Probably it is just a misunderstanding caused - again - by the level of my English, so I will try again: On period drawing, crown sweatband from both sides of the crown is not in the contact with the crowns in any point. As we can clearly see, sweatband on your badge as well as on Tifes one, is in contact with the crown at one point (in the peak of last curve). Photo of reverse shows it even better. This point of contact (red arrows) can´t be seen neither on period drawing, nor on my badge. PS: I do not want to doubt originality of your or Tifes badge. It is undoubtely accepted wartime awarded original. I just want to discuss my type of badge, and find her timeframe. Best Regards, Miro

Picture below is showing upscaled and resized drawing of Karl Badge from Verordnungsblatt 47/1917. To the left of period drawing is accepted early type (probably in privately purchased version, but overall as well as detailed features are nearly identical). To the right is my type of Karl badge (photo taken from emedals, as I wanted to show both badges on white background as is on period drawing). For better orientation I will call the left badge "Yours" and right badge "Mine". 1.: Your Karl Type badge to the left has both ends of headband (sweatband) in contact with crown. On period drawing, the ends of headband don´t touch the crown. Same as on mine Karl type to the right. 2. On period drawing, as well as on mine type, the wreath under the right wing is visibly thinner (from outer side). On your type, it is approximately of same width there as anywhere else. 3. Right foot on "K" letter is visibly lower than the left foot. On period drawing, and on my type. Surprisingly, your badge has letter K visibly tilted to opposite side with right foot higher than the left one. 4. Laurel wreath under the left wing is wider, because of leaf "bending" to the inner side. On period drawing, as well as on my type. Contrary to this, on your Karl Type, there is just the cut to the leaves profile. 5. There are even more surprising similarities, but these are not clearly seen on these pics. For example, there is a fancy bow on sweatband under the crowns - again identically on period drawing and on my type. On your type, there is just a tight knot - and four strips of sweatband going to four sides (ok, maybe there is a small bow, but completely different shape). Of course, there is also one big difference: period drawing and your type have hooks, while mine is on needle. I am thinking of possibility, that Karl badge started with the pin and after a short time it was changed to two hooks. This is in this moment the only explanation for me, how Verordnungsblatt 47/1917 can speak about two hooks, but still show "my" type (just without the pin). Is there any chance that mentioned Verordnungsblatt 47/1917 is not about changing the FJ Type to Karl Type (and about changing the hardware in the same moment), but just about changing the pin on Karl Type to two hooks?

Hello Tifes, I somehow missed your response and found it only now. Thank you for confirmation, that my badge is war-time original. I would like just to add, that Verordnungsblatt 47/1917 you are mentioning, really speaks about changing the hardware from needle to two hooks (Karabinerhaften) - but the badge, drawn in that Verordnungsblatt, depicts "my" badge, not the Karl badge you consider as the only Karl awarded type. I know, everyone can say it´s only illustration, but it is surprising how it matches my type and differs from award type accepted by you.

Onyx crosses surely weren´t produced for award ceremonies led by Kaiser. II think we can say it safely after all those years. They were luxury private purchases from postwar era. Here is a nice proof from my collection. Matt enamelled piece by C. F. Zimmermann. We know this slim frame and crown/letters style from postwar CFZ pieces with blued core, EK2s and vaulted EK1s as well. I think there is not anyone who ever supposed these be produced wartime. And what was not produced wartime, couldn´t be produced for Kaiser.

My opinion is still the same: These (KO) crosses are in Kling marked boxes, because Kling distributed them. Maybe Kling was an owner of contract and subcontracted Klein to make crosses for him. It widely happens here and now as well, for example in engineering industry. Many winners of contract competitions are not the companies, who know to do it (anything), but companies with bests lobbists (and contacts, logically). Sometimes the winning company consists of lobbists only without any production facility. All they do by themselves is producing invoices. In both cases (jewelery and engineering) the contract must be "delivered" or realised under the name of contract winner, not under the name of subcontractors (though these are the real makers of contract subject). This is how I see Kling´s label on those delivery boxes. The other opportunity, but with identical result is, that there are (and surely were) many producers - mainly those bigger ones - who don´t delivery their products instantly to the target customer, but only to distribution (wholeasale) companies. You can´t go to Wolfsburg, to Volkswagen production facility and order one Volkswagen. You must go to authorised dealer, who will sell you one. When you will buy it, there will be VW logo on the front grill - and authorised dealer´s sticker on luggage doors.

No problem, I understand. But you can send me a pm, or email anytime

I already said when discussing another A-H maker Kuhmayer, that there is more reliable method of translating from azbuka. Make the photo or scan of the page(s) and post it here. I will throw it to English really quickly. You will have it translated and I will have it read. Not a bad deal, hm?

Very nice and valuable cross by Deutscher Offizersverein (DOV). Congrats.

Unfortunately, now with closer pics I see, that the cross is not 100% Hansen. It´s obverse from late TR Steinhauer and Luck with original reverse disc from Hansen. Hansen´s obverse looks like this: Slightly different obverse was used on earlier Hansens - like this one:

Looks like you are running out of space

Nice collection. Can we see some closeups of that Imperial Hansen EK in etui? Personally, first time I see Hansen cased in fitting box.

It´s correct cross. From latest series, (1850´s), typical for straight arms frame.

Both nice originals. Second one is KO mounted on really interesting bar.

Hi Demir, Sorry to say Deschlersohn EK1 is a repro. It appears mostly as 1870 fake, but rarely can be seen as 1914er (with the same crown and W style). Company Deschler & Sohn, Munich never marked its pieces with incorrect name Deschlersohn. They used "D" mark for Imperial pieces (they produced mostly Bavarian Militärverdienstkreuz) or (later) their PKZ (1) or LDO (L/10) code. If you compare it with your original EK2s a and b, it is no match in quality, materials and construction. EK2 c is the same one piece fake as EK1.

Schlossfreiheit 4 was the first address of Godet company in Berlin. Jean Godet rented this building in 1761 and bought it to his possession in 1793 (February 19). Company Godet left the Schlossfreiheit in 1893. In June 1894, this street was demolished to free the space for Kaiser´s Wilhelm I. Natonal Memorial. This photo of Schlossfreiheit street is from 1892 and Godet company still can be seen there (on total left).

It´s Otto Schickle.

You are right. Bars on minis are not often to find, but sometimes they do appear

Hi Chris, EW is considered to be Emil Weichmann, Berlin.

I already posted this to Minis thread, but maybe it belongs here as well. Centenary rosette by Godet.

Non combatant Prussian trifold.

Here one 1870er

Nice pieces shown. Here some of my WW1 ones.

No problem with this one. Nice original cross.