David M

I am looking for data on the German Gesandtschaft at Kiew during the second half of 1918. Also looking for data on the German Milit?rkomission in Kiew, in 1918. Any information, especially an overview of the militairy officers present would be very much appreciated!! The brother of Louis M?ldner von M?lnheim, Georg, was Bevollm?chtigter of the Kriegsministerium there and before that a member of the Milit?rkommission in Kiew from 17.05.1918 onwards

As it says Hofjuwelier and Gera, I suppose there should be something Reussian in there, but that's obvious or am I wrong?

HI Yankee I would be interested in a picture of the Oberst too! My guess is contacting the bavarian states archive, since that was the country he served in the militairy. Here is the better part: in bavaria, the law says that when the archive looks something up for you, its for free. So you could ask them if there is a picture of the Oberst, you would only need to pay for the reproduction itself. Should you contact the Archive, I hope you woill let me know what you find out!! I would be very interested in a photo especially one taken where he is wearing his ChW3!! Regards David

Hi Glenn, does your source state in which year he received the CHW3? Regards David

write me down for one of each! Any idea of the costs per issue? David

Where could we find a list of the recipients of the Dutch Crown Order? Would it be at the Huisarchief? or at the Kanselarij der Nederlandse Orden? David

Dear Gents! Would there be a way to find out the orders and decorations of: 4f. Friedrich von Marschall, geboren Spangenberg 26.12.1878, 1915 Oberleutnant der Landwehr J?ger I, kgl. preuss. Hauptmann a.D., verstorben Marburg 16.12.1949, my interest is purely genealogical, his mother was a born M?ldner von M?lnheim I would also like to know the exact information about his promotion in 1915 (date e.g.) Thanks so much! David

I did not know the Order of the Dutch Lion was instituted for the southern part of the Koninkrijk only? Why did it not become a belgian order with a namechange lateron? David

Thanks Glenn thats great!! I hope to get a picture of his grandfather Johann Michael Ritter von Deines. This was a kurhessian Finanzrat, a commander 1st class of the CHGL. JMD got the austrian nobility in 1847, so technically Adolf held 2 nations nobility by the end of his life

Hi Glenn That's right! I already got his career dates from Priesroff outside this forum! David

Would anyone have the following book: Das Husaren-Regiment K?nig Wilhelm I. <1. Rheinisches> No 7 ; Von d. Formation d. Stammregiments bis z. Gegenwart. Bearb. von Adolf v. Deines As I understand correctly, there should be apicture of general Deines in there?

Dear Gents Would anyone have a book titled German naval air service by an englishman? called Andrew Imrie? I would really like to know whta kind of info it holds, as a cousein of my greatgrandfather was in the Marine Flieger. More infor on his career via this link http://www.frontflieger.de/3muewi0t.html Thanks so much David

HI Christophe I am not exactly sure, but I think it is about the jewlers who made the mall for the stampning of medals. You can reach Beyreiss via his site on oldenburg-orden www.oldenburg-orden.de

You could also contact F. Beyreiss, but his book is just about Friedhelm Beyrei? Verzeichnis der Stempelschneider deutscher Ehrenzeichen Jever 2003 Selbstverlag which is not the same as orders I guess.....

Hi Jacky Thanks so much for your reply. Do you know if the medals are the same as the House Order of Orange? I will wait for Erik to get back from his tweede kerstdag holiday. Although living in Holland myself, I am still behindmy laptop most of the time during these holidays... Happy new year David

What ever happened to the Dutch Crown Order? I know it exists, but never found recipients anywhere.....

DearGents Sometime ago I presented my site to you. I made some mayor changes a few weeks later because I was not really happy with the way I handled it. Anyway, here is a second try. I mainly focussed on the rule of Kurf?rst Wilhelm II. these last months and although not finished yet, I place a link to the page which holds the data I gathered so far. I would like to know how you think I am progressing with my project as it is. Besides the data you will find already, I am also thinking of adding the dates on which the Kurf?rst would allow one of his subjects to wear a previously received foreign order. I do not know if this is common practice or not. I do think it adds something. Especially when we look of the example of the imperial french legion d'honneur here. It was awarded during the time of the occupation by Napoleon. The restored Kurf?rst Wilhelm I. (ruled 1814-1821) did not allow his subject to wear this medal, because he did not recognise the service of his men under foreign rule (1806-1813). Lateron his son Wilhelm II. started allowing the waering of the FEL, as the restored french kings continued the award. Anyway, I think my new try is nicer then before. Tell me what you think!! And please be nice, as it is chrismas! Merry christmas and a happy new year! David Link: http://www.virtute-et-fidelitate.net/ choose Wilhelm II. 1821-1831 in the menu on the left side of the screen I have been working on pictures today. I updated the frontpage of the site and added a picture of Wilhelm II. on his webpage and of Johann Philipp Bauer, Generallieutenant at the page of his son (access via medalbars in the left-menu)

Hi Rick just 1 stupid question Why does the List in S?tterlin read Hauptmann und yours RM (Rittmeister I guess?) David

Hil Ulsterman from the description I found on the web, I don;t think there is much detail on the recipients of the O&E of these particular duchies in this book is there? Regards David

Hi Gents! Would anyone have the following book Bibliography of Orders and Decorations by Mulder and Alec Purvis (nice bloke), 321 pp. 1999. softbound I would like to know how it is setup and if it contains any bibliographical notes on the House Order of th White Falcon of Sachse-Weimar The House Order of the Honor Cross of Schwarzburg-R and S The Houde order of the Golden Lion of Kurhessen Hope to hear from anyone of you Best regards David

Hi Ulsterman Would you be able to check the book on literature on the Kurhessian House order of the golden lion as well? Thanks David

Would anyone know if there are books about the GSF (founded 1732) or the Scharzburg House Order of the honor Cross (founded 1853) for the pre 1871 era? Thanks a lot David

Hi Rick Dont feel rushed. I am just very happy someones taking this huge job to describing these rolls. I myself am busy describing the 1821-1831 episode of the kurhessian House Order of the Golden Lion. My entries at this moment look like this: From the lists of Commanders I. Class: 08.01.1831 Georg Carl Wilhelm M?ldner von M?lnheim (kurhessischer Adelsstand: Wilhelmsh?he 07.01.1831 mit v. M.). Geboren Breuna bei Wolfhagen 27.09.1782, gestorben Hanau 07.01.1863; Generalmajor und Generaladjutant, Commandeur des Regiments Garde-Gendarmerie zu Pferde, provisorischer Ministerialvorstand im Kriegsministerium. 01.11.1811 WK2a, 04.08.1815 OEH, 23.07.1821 OPVM, 07.03.1812 FEL 13.12.1822, 1821 DE. Arndt S. 451; Schr?der S. 897. Were the foreign recipients are concerned, I have a shorter entry, not describing the other awards and just the HGL. The double date at the FEL entry has to do with the date of award and the date of permission to wear it by the Elector. David

In this thread I hope we will be able to make an overview of the literature available on the orders and decorations of the pre-imperial German era. By doing this, the gaps in literature will be known and enthusiasts will be able to see where there are possibilities of writing valuable works to fill these gaps. Important to notice is that there are (IMHO) 2 kinds of books about orders: books just describing the decorations (the jewelry of the order if you like) and the recipients of the order. The catalogues of e.g. Nimmergut fill in the gap for the description of the jewelry, or don't they? Frankfurth, Reichsfreie Stadt (1816-1866), General-gouvernement (1813-1816) and Grossherzogtum (1807-1813) - Heyden, H. von: Der Condordien-Orden, die Ehrenmedaillen, sowie die Feldzugs- und Dienstalterszeichen des Grossherzogtums, des General-Gouvernements und der freien Stadt Frankfurt, in : Kleine Reihe f?r Freunde der Ordens und Ehrenzeichen-Kunde, No. 11, Hamburg (o.J.). The book does give a list of the Knights of the grandducal Concordia-Orden and the recipients of the Medal of the General-Gouvernement for the 1814 campaign. It also describes the history of the other medals of the several reigns. Kurhessen (Hessen-Kassel) General Sauer, Werner: Die Orden und Ehrenzeichen des Kurf?rstentums Hessen-Kassel, in : Kleine Reihe f?r Freunde der Ordens und Ehrenzeichen-Kunde, No. 7, Hamburg (o.J.).. This book describes the jewelry of the kurhessian orders and decorations. Of the OEH, the jewelry and Knights are described. Furthermore, the book gives the Statuten of all the medals and decorations except for the Militairy and civil service medals 1821-1832. And provides the numbers of awards of the Milit?rverdienstkreuz 1832-1847, 1849-1851 and the Wilhelmsorden (1851-1866). Unfortunately, Sauer does not give the sources he used. Hausorden vom goldenen L?wen (1770-1866) I am working on that at the moment. Orden pour la virtu militaire (equivalent to the prussian OPM) Losch, P.: Der Orden Pour la Vertu Militaire und seine Ritter in: Zeitschrift des Vereins f?r Hessische Geschichte und Landeskunde, Vol. II., S. 23-62. Kassel (1917). Describing the Knights, not the jewels Orden vom Eisernen Helm (1814-1816) (equivalent to the prussian EK) See General. Oldenburg Beyreiss, Friedhelm Preussen Klenau Arnhard Graf: Die Verleihungen des preussischen Rothen Adler Ordens in der ersten und zweiten Klasse von 1810 bis 1854, (PHV-Verlag). Offenbach (1997). Describing the Knights, not the jewelry Sachsen, K?nigreich Roth, Erhard: Die Verleihungen des Hausordens der Rautenkrone, des Verdienstordens, des Verdienstordens mit Schwertern (bis 1914) sowie der Damenorden des K?nigreichs Sachsen, (PHV-Verlag). Offenbach (1998). I hope you will help me in adding more books and smaller articles. Sould anyone feel obliged to comment on this initiative, be it positive or more with some criticisme, feel free to do so.

Would the Anhalt Staatshandb?cher have list of recipients? Maybe from that list, you would be able to make an assumption of the reason and/or circumstances it was awarded. Maybe the Statuten of the order would say something about this aswell