Ed_Haynes

The status of the bronze coronation medal is vague. Only the silver was ever official, though the bronzes existed. It is unclear why. What is even less officicial are the silvered bronze medals, probably an interim solution to the late supply of medals from London. The real (silver) medals were struck on the same plancet as the QE2 coronation (leftovers?). If anyone wants more information and images, I can provide.

While this may well be fake, what in the world does the seller's gender have to do with the matter??????

Correct, Nick. To dismiss him glibly as a "spin doctor" comes close to a dangerous misunderstanding of history.

But, however much fun this is, much of it is Back on theme . . . I was struck that while Wardak wears his royalist awards, the second officer shown still wears his PDRA awards. An interesting mix.

And many of them never got far out of the luxurious southern suburbs of New Delhi.

Not a nit, thanks Dave. Fingers got disconnected from mind. Oops. Thanks for other observations and info. From all I heard there, calling Wardak "flamboyant" is an understatement.

We care, Eric, we care. But we're mad too! We're all mad here!!!!!!!!!

One more . . . for the time being.

More . . . and more to come.

More . . .

Some new (updated) images. All in one place. Starting with single, uncased, undocumented items.

We do do a good job here, don't we?! Er??l mendiin t?l??!!

Nice eye-candy, Paul. Thanks!

Thanks!

I don't THINK any such problem exists on this forum (unlike others), but I always feel a bit ethically queasy doing these public recommendations. All I'll say is that these are the guys I use. Period. Why I deal with them and not others reflects my interests and what they stock. Other fine UK dealers never bother with medals to Indians so I don't bother with them.

Dealers? Not sure this is kosher (shuddh? halal?) but these are the ones I use the most (in alphabetical order): Philip Burman - http://www.military-medals.co.uk/grandlist.htm Chris Dixon - http://www.dixonsmedals.co.uk/ Frontier Medals - http://www.frontiermedals.com/ Liverpool Medal Company - http://www.liverpoolmedals.com/ There are others. I am not bothering with the "mainly-auction" places like DNW or Spink. If inappropriate for the forum, this can surely be deleted.

The serial numbers are even harder to photograph and the images will be even worse (sorry). It may be time to drag out the old SLR? Or borrow my wife's microscope?? Left - "higher" - 63, very shallow Right - "lower" - 161, really close to the flagpole, but you may have to take my word on this Sorry.

I apologize for lousy photos of the reverse. Heavy pre-Ernesto rain precludes outside photography. Mintmarks. "Higher" on left, "lower" on right. I don't know if these lousy photos will tell you anything?!

Are there differences? Yes. The "Higher Assembly" badge is less rich in enamel color (does this make sense) and feels older. Is it a matter of wear of manufacture? Or . . . ?? What are the differences in the legend? Must find out! More questions than answers just now.

If you MUST eBay, rather than work with real dealers, look for an award to a regiment (not to a corps or artillery) -- easier to research! Actually, the 2007 Medal Yearbook is due out soon, wait for that one maybe??

A not-so-good image of the Ghaz? Mir Masyedi Khan Medal, apparently awarded to those killed in action (including "foreign friends"?).

Another image of Gen. Wardak. Note US "Ranger" and "Airborne" tabs. Truly, the "very model of a modern" . . . general (?).

Antici . . . pation!

Just following up on this last thought, I have been playing some comparative numbers games, looking at the current estimated total award numbers of Mongolian awards and comparing them to their closest Soviet "cousins". While there have been significantly fewer Mongolian awards ever "out there", I'd suggest that there are even fewer "out there" in captivity and in collector circulation. Yet there are (so far) fewer serious phalerists who study and collect Mongolian awards than there are for Soviet awards. (Good!) Nevertheless, some comparisons are useful. When you wonder "how 'rare' is this Mongolian award?", the total numbers awards are part of the answer, and it is interesting to see how they compare to Soviet numbers (taken from the Red Bible, as it is close at hand). I am ignoring the early, rare, mostly exchanged versions and concentrating on the common, plain, recent awards. Hero of the Mongolian People's Republic This is a hard one to gague. There were approximately 41 awarded, indcluding replacement awards for the first type badge. This would put it somewhere between the Order of Victory (14 awards) and the first suspension-style Suvorov 1st class (108 awards). The direct analogue, the Hero of the Soviet Union, was awarded some 12,000 times. Hero of Labor of the MPR Also not an easy one. It has been awarded around 400 times. This places it in the same range as the Bogdan Khmelnitsky 1st class (~ 400 awards). The Hero of Socialist Labor was awarded some 20,000 times! Sukhbaatar Order Awarded around 2,000 times, this compares to the Suvorov 2nd class (~ 3,000) or Kutuzov 2nd class (~ 3,400). Order of the Red Banner of Military Valor (I am using Battushig's translations) Awarded around 6,000 times, this compares roughly with the Kutuzov 3rd class (~ 8,000). Order of the Red Banner of Labor Valor Awarded around 10,000 times, this compares closely with the Bogdan Khmelnitsky 3rd class (~ 10,000). Order of Combat Valor Also awarded around 10,000 times, this also compares with the Bogdan Khmelnitsky 3rd class (~ 10,000). Order of the Polar Star Awarded some 40,000 times, this compares to the Alexander Nevsky (~ 49,000). Order of Mother Heroine, 1st class Awarded some 60,000 times, this common award is hard to compare, but falls between the Order of the October Revolution (~ 110,000) and the Alexander Nevsky (~ 49,000). Order of Mother Heroine, 2nd class Awarded some 210,000 times, this common award compares with the Order of the Patriotic War 1st class (~ 312,000 times, ignoring the 1985 awards). Honorary Medal of Combat Awarded 25,000 times, this is close to the Hero of Socialist Labor (~ 20,000 awards). Honorary Medal of Labor Also awarded 25,000 times, this too is close to the Hero of Socialist Labor (~ 20,000 awards). Medal for Unselfishness Awarded around 1,000 times, this is half the number of awards of the Bogdan Khmelnitsky 2nd class (~ 2,000) and closer to the Kutuzov 1st class (~ 900 awards). Numbers aren't the whole story, of course, and the inability (so far) to research Mongolian awards plays a role in "value". Yet, you can compare the site of a prominent New Jersey dealer who has undocumented and unresearched Alexander Nevskys at $1250 and $1995 (~ 49,000 awards) and Polar Stars (~ 40,000 awards) ranging from $475 (Mongolian obverse) to $54 (silver pinback). The same dealer shows Bogdan Khmelnitsky 3rd class awards at $3900 and $3550, while the Order of Combat Valor (also awarded around 10,000 times) comes in at $380. He has an unresearched Suvorov 2nd class at $14,800; what would the price be for an also-issued-around-2000-specimens Subhbaatar? But, in these cases, which are "rarer"? Simple supply and demand? Or reasons not to whine over rising prices? Something to think about . . . ??? (And, as a footnote, those who think there is no more "good stuff" to be had obviously haven't looked at some of my recent posts on this forum.)

The best information I know would be at Steen Ammentorp's fine site: http://www.generals.dk/general/Kvarternik/...ko/Croatia.html