Daniel Murphy

Alexandre, I think you would do better to select one man and give all available information you know about him. I have seen some of the guys on here do miracles, but just finding this info on one man can take hours pouring over old dusty books. 45 names with no ranks, no dates of service, no branch of service, no birth or death dates, is above and beyond the call of duty for the researchers among us. Dan Murphy

Dan, Nice 1813,and great family reunion you have going there. Dan

Could an Imperial Russian naval badge be the inspiration for the naval wound badge? Looks like it to me, check out this link to the imperial Russian section of the forum. Especially look at posts 7, 8 and 9. Number 9 has the same type of anchor with a loop at the top. Dan Murphy Russian badges

Joe, I do not see anything that would allow for the catalog to be dated any better than Rick's estimate. There may be something else in the catalog that would be of more help in dating it. However if it is being reprinted then I understand you do not want to give all the info away here for free. I have sent you a PM. Dan Murphy

THAT? Is supposed to be the highest decoration the German government could give for bravery. Look at how the beading has been sanded down to "make it look used" and how all of the edges have been played with. And the cross hatching at the corners? . Dan Murphy

Joe, Glad you could make it to the club. Dan Murphy

Rick, I can understand why you are excited. When I saw not only the Albert Cross, but the Merit Cross and both with swords, I muttered under my breath....OMFG. That is indeed a prize. Dan Murphy

Accidental second post. Sorry.

Two of those naval badges look like the inspiration for the Imperial German Naval wound badge. The orders are of course great as well. If you have never had a change to visit this museum, it is a must see! Dan Murphy

Andrew, Here is the 1st Bavarian Reserve Division order of battle in 1917, according to allied intelligence. Source: Histories of the 251 Divisions of the German Army which participated in the war (1914-1918). London Stamp Exchange Ltd. 1989. "1st BAVARIAN RESERVE DIVISION. INFANTRY The 1st Bavarian Reserve Brigade: 1st Bav. Res. Rgt. 2nd Bav. Res. Rgt. 3rd Bav. Res. Rgt. CAVALRY 3rd Squadron of the 3rd Bavarian Chevauxleger Rgt. ARTILLERY 13th Bavarian Artillery Command: 1st Bav. Res. Field Art. Rgt. ENGINEERS AND LIASONS 17th Bavarian Pioneer Battalion : 1st Bav. Res. Pion. Co. 3rd Bav. Res. Pion. Co. 7th Bav. Res. Pion. Co. 201 Trench Mortar Co. (not listed as Bavarian) 1st Bavarian Reserve Searchlight Section. 401st Bavarian Telephone Detachment. MEDICAL AND VETERINARY 15th Bavarian Ambulance Co. 45th Bavarian Field Hospital. 48th Bavarian Field Hospital. 49th Bavarian Field Hospital. Veterinary Hospital. TRANSPORT 750th Motor Transport Column. (Not listed as Bavarian) Here is the entry for the year 1917. Artois. 1. After some time at rest, the division went back into line on February 27th to the north of Arras (Roclincourt-Neuville St. Vaast). April 9th it received the full shock of the British attack- lost the villages of Thelus and Bailleul and lost 1500 prisoners. La Bassee. 2. Relieved about the 15th of April, the division rested and then entered line north of the La Bassee Canal (east of Festubert). It remained here five months taking no part in any important engagements, but suffering losses as a result of gas attacks. Flanders. 3. It left for Belgium October 6-7, and took over the Zandvoorde secotr (southeast of Ypres) on the 8th. Value 1917 estimate. The 1st Bavarian Reserve Division is a good division, but it's combattant value cannot be compared to that of the active Bavarian divisions." Not much of an entry for such an important battle, but I hope it helps. Of course a regimental history would provide more detail information. Dan Murphy

Haynau, You have a most beautiful and unique EK1. Mike, There are indeed cast cores used in the convex crosses. I see more cast cores than I see stamped from thin metal. The manufacturer just had to cast them in a different mold. It is next to impossible (or maybe impossible) to heat a cast iron core and bend it. Even if possible, this would not only be labor intensive, but would result in a lot of wastage and possible damage to the core. Therefore it is just not practical from the stance of manpower and the neccesary increase in cost to the buyer. Why do it the hard way? By 1914 the metallurgy had been much improved since 1813 and 1870, consequently you see less cracking of the cores. You do see it but it is more caused by external stresses (heavy use and misuse ) than internal. I can post a half a dozen vaulted crosses with cast cores from my collection if need be. You have to understand that a person who purchased a cross from a top quality manufacturer, expected top quality construction and materials. He was after all paying for it. If you bought a cheaper piece, you got cheaper construction. This is where the stamped thin steel cores and one piece crosses fall in. In short you got what you paid for. Here is a vaulted cross from a recent thread with it's cracked IRON core. There is also a link to the thread. Rothe and Neffe EK1

I thought it was horn from the photo, the mottled color gave it away. The only thing I would add is not to store it in an area where there is extreme or rapid fluctuations in temperature or humidity. This can cause horn to curl up and crack. No attic or basement storage. Kept at normal room temperature and humidity ( and away from pests like Carpet Beetles) it should last forever. As a kid I used to buy old mounted antlers for my room. I soon found out what Carpet beetles were. In their larval state, they will actually eat horn, antlers, wool or any other item which comes from an animal. Yes I have seen munched-on horn gripped dress bayonets at shows. Dan Murphy

What he is showing is the back side of a 1939 RK. And a fake one at that. Notice there is no oakleaves or crown on the 1813 side and the measurements are listed at 47.5 mm. A GK would be 58mm or so. You can bet your @$$ that if it was a real RK it would be called as such and that they would at least show a photo of the front with a covered swastika. On the second piece, it looks like a Latvian fake in an original case. I don't think it is original to an 1870 EK1, but it is original to something. Where the EK sits looks too small.

Rick, That is one of the most magnicient swords I have ever seen. Dan Murphy

Pat, The way the sharp edge (clipped edge) on top of the blade is milled is a sure sign of a 1920's to 30's dress bayonet. This was not done before that period and is a result of a change in regulations during that period. It does make for a good looking blade and helps date them. It is not unusual for there to be no other markings (except for the maker) on this type of piece since these were not issued, but had to be purchased by the owner. Normally when other markings are present it is in the form of engraving or blade etching. A key I use to tell Imperial German from later pieces is that most dress bayonets (of the 98 style) from the imperial time have horn scales on the hilt and THREE rivets to hold them. Most of these were made between 1915-18 (or possibly even later in the 20's) when the officers no longer wore their swords in the field. Imperial pieces also have a standard point like on a issue bayonet and can even be sawbacks. Even the darkest horn (buffalo, cow, etc.) is mottled. Look for slight variations in the black color ranging from green to dark gray etc.. Also horn has a grain just like wood and this grain can sometimes be seen on the narrow edges of the scales where they have not been checkered(i.e. the top and bottom edges when the piece is held upright and horizonal). They are out there but hard to find. On many the hilt and scabbard both are enameled black. Your piece does look like it might be horn. If so it would be the latest one I have seen. 99%of the ones made in the 20's-30's have a form of plastic or bakelite for the grip scales. You have a very nice complete piece, even better if it has horn scales. Dan Murphy

Antti, For my 500th post, please add one Rothe & Neffe convex. It is marked "R&_" with just a partial last letter and has Austrian silver hallmarks under the pin near the hinge. On the top of the pin it is marked "900". Dan Murphy

Antti, Add one more Z to your list. Thanks, Dan

Here is a close of the EK. Notice that each arm is a separate piece. If anyone has any comments, questions or want a closeup of anything, let me know. Dan Murphy

The inside showing a chip.

Back side showing the hinge.

Here is a small item I picked up some time ago out of Germany. It is a wooden snuffbox which is inlaid with silver and is lacquered or japanned. The bottom and the lid are each carved from one piece of wood and the hinge is a handmade one using a steel pin and 3 pieces of brass folded around it to form the hinge. The box is 76mm long, 39mm wide and 22mm high. Jappanning was copied from oriental enamel and was used in Europe in the 18th and 19th centuries on a variety of materials. With the onset of the industrial revolution items that were once laboriously made by hand could be made much quicker and simpler. After the 1850's metal boxes made of iron or other metals replaced the more fragile wood in their construction. Ok, enough of that, here are the pics. Dan Murphy

The first badge is apparently supposed to be a hat insignia made on by a crewman on a U-Boat. Normally even though sometimes handmade, these insignia were a badge of honor worn by the the crews. Therefore a great deal of care was used in making them or they were jeweler made. This one looks like it was made by a 5 year old with a hatchet. The 1813..... well it would look better without the crown. I suppose that is to represent the owner has had it for 50 years? Dan Murphy

A private by any other name is still a private. If a private was in an infantry regiment, he was a Musketier. If he transferred to a jager battalion, he would be referred to as a Jager. If he was then transferred to an artillery unit he would be a Kannonier. This applies as long as he is actually transferred to the unit. The rank of Musketier would be crossed through on his soldbuch and militar pass and the new rank of Jager would be written in. If he is a Musketier temporarily attached to a jager battalion that has suffered heavy casualties (for instance), his official rank would still be Musketier. In that case he would still wear infantry uniform, headgear and fieldgear. During the war, there was a shortage of uniforms. A man transferred to another type of unit would not necessarily receive a new uniform or shoulder straps since they might not be available to be issued. When the units supply system received a new shipment of uniforms and shoulderstraps, they would then be issued out to those in need. This may take a few weeks or a few months. Even then, if the man had a serviceable uniform (no matter what kind) he would probably not recieve a new one, just straps. The supply officer or NCO did not care care what kind of uniform it was as long as it was serviceable. If the supply NCO wanted to issue him one, but he wore an extra small or extra large uniform, he was probably still out of luck. Most of the uniforms received would be in medium sizes. The next thought is... If the man was issued a uniform just because he transferred to that unit, what would the unit do with the other uniform? Now they have a uniform that they cannot issue, the only choice would be to return it back up the line for reissue to another unit. The unit has now gone from having a uniform in the field and having a uniform in supply, to just having a uniform in the field. When you look at it like this, it just does not make sense to issue that new uniform when faced with severe shortages during wartime. Dan Murphy

This is a "square" maker marked badge. And the only Bavarian one I have seen by them. Bloody shame it was cut, but it does tell a story. It does not have to have been an officers badge, there were many more unsung enlisted pilots serving with the various types of squadrons. It most likely was an issue badge. Dan Murphy

All of the awards shown here appear to have been awarded by veterans organizations, including the Prussian Landes Kriegerverband piece. I have never seen the Saxon badge before, but it is a nice piece. Glaser was one of the suppliers of imperial orders to Saxony before and during WW1. Dan Murphy