should you clean a gallantry order?

[paddywhack]

well after FINALLY finding where id last left my military cross(yes i bloody lost the thing thanks to my flat mate putting it "away"!!) im wondering if it wouldn't be a good thing to clean it! i know ALOT of people say you shouldn't but iv been thinking!this award is a VERY high and prized award so shouldn't they be kept clean! mines is ww1 one and is near on brown with the tarnish!i know that tarnish stands for 70+ years of its history but after seeing other MCs i do get the feeling that it does need a clean im still in 2 minds because no soldier who won it would be aloud to wear it in the dirty state its in!!what are your guys feeling on it??should it at least get a light cleaning???? any advice would be great!! :beer:

[Hugh]

well after FINALLY finding where id last left my military cross(yes i bloody lost the thing thanks to my flat mate putting it "away"!!) im wondering if it wouldn't be a good thing to clean it! i know ALOT of people say you shouldn't but iv been thinking!this award is a VERY high and prized award so shouldn't they be kept clean! mines is ww1 one and is near on brown with the tarnish!i know that tarnish stands for 70+ years of its history but after seeing other MCs i do get the feeling that it does need a clean im still in 2 minds because no soldier who won it would be aloud to wear it in the dirty state its in!!what are your guys feeling on it??should it at least get a light cleaning???? any advice would be great!!

I seem to be a minority on this, but I believe in light cleaning. That's what a soldier would do. No Brasso!

Hugh

[paddywhack]

thats what im thinking!this medal should be silver!its really just brown at the moment!!

Edited March 2, 2010 by paddywhack

[Brian Wolfe]

I wouldn't.

This question comes up from time to time and it is a matter of personal taste. I wouldn't attenpt to explain my view for the very reason that it is a personal view.

If you decide to clean it please post the results, I for one will enjoy enjoy viewing it either way and respect your choice.

Regards

Brian

[Mervyn Mitton]

As Brian has said - this is an old question that always brings different points of view. I agree with the general rule of not cleaning - unless dirt is actually defacing the medal. Being a shop we leave the purchaser to decide if he want's to clean.

With your MC the patination is not particularly attractive and I would clean. I have just purchased an MC in similar condition and it will also, be cleaned. Now, how to clean. Do not use any of the normal shelf products like Silvo. They are harsh and abrasive - as are all cleaners, the secret is to find the one that is least abrasive. We use an English product - Wright's silver cleaner. Comes in a small plastic jar , with a sponge applicator - you should be able to buy this in any good jewellers. Remeber, the MC is sterling silver and it is because of this that they should not be cleaned too often - silver is soft and if you rub hard the detail gets lost.

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Paddywhack,

Nice looking cross

I would give it a bath in warm soapy water first, then use a well worn tooth brush whose bristles are very soft, to get washing-up liqued into all the nooks & crannies, its amazing what dirt such action can shift without harming the item.

Rinse thoroughly in clean warm water,

then rub dry with paper kitchen towls.

After this you can decide if it needs further attension.

Kevin in Deva.

[Rundberg]

Hello Paddywhack,

Personally I wouldn´t do anything at all. The patina of the medal gives some extra charm!

But IF I was "forced" to do anything, then Kevin in Devas suggestions are sound. And I would stay well away from any other method.

All the best,

Chris

[paddywhack]

Dont get me wrong i love the patina on the cross but as one of britains top gallantry awards isnt it being in this state doing it a dis-service? Thanks though for the tips on cleaning and the replies!!

[Brian Wolfe]

Dont get me wrong i love the patina on the cross but as one of britains top gallantry awards isnt it being in this state doing it a dis-service? Thanks though for the tips on cleaning and the replies!!

I can see what you are getting at and can't disagree with you.

I think my opinion is based on collecting coins many years ago. My father passed down this attitude of not cleaning a coin [medal] as the patina was treasures by many. So, when I thought about it a little more, I am convinced that it is just a matter of personal taste. If and/or when you clean it and post the results I know I for one will more than likely praise your decision.

Regards

Brian

[muckaroon1960]

I have a WW1 MC in it's case and although it is a bit grubby especially on the back of the medal and the ribbon I would not dream of cleaning it? This is a personal choice however but remember once cleaned this cannot be reversed?

[peter monahan]

I'm with Hugh. The patina, to me, represents neglect and not honourable age, as the soldier would have worn it shiny. But, personal opinion, so no need to either accept or refute it!

Also agree with Kev re 'gentle cleaning'. Soap and water for the dirt and 5 minutes dipped in tomato paste/tomato ketchup, whose mild acidity will eat the tarnish but not the medal, folowup by a very good rinse off.

BUT, I would NOT dry it with paper towels: they can scratch but, more importantly, have sulphur dioxide in them and will hasten the development of new tarnish. Sulphur dioxide is the stuff that's 'acid' in non-acid free paper and the bane of museums and document collectors. Instead, use on of your oldest socks - clean, of course -or a jeweller's cloth to lightly buff dry.

Peter

Edited March 3, 2010 by peter monahan

[Kev in Deva]

I'm with Hugh. The patina, to me, represents neglect and not honourable age, as the soldier would have worn it shiny. But, personal opinion, so no need to either accept or refute it!

Also agree with Kev re 'gentle cleaning'. Soap and water for the dirt and 5 minutes dipped in tomato paste/tomato ketchup, whose mild acidity will eat the tarnish but not the medal, folowup by a very good rinse off.

BUT, I would NOT dry it with paper towels: they can scratch but, more importantly, have sulphur dioxide in them and will hasten the development of new tarnish. Sulphur dioxide is the stuff that's 'acid' in non-acid free paper and the bane of museums and document collectors. Instead, use on of your oldest socks - clean, of course -or a jeweller's cloth to lightly buff dry.

Peter

I will have you know My Transylvanian brand is a soft as a babys bum :lol:

[paddywhack]

right well i reckon if im not to hung over sunday il give it a light clean and see what happens!!! :beer:

[Noor]

Eh paddy, i bet you have a hung over!

[gongz]

Hi there

Dirty medals - NEVER Sar Major.....

Never use abrasive polishes - that includes "most" silver cleaning cloths - they are impregnated with very fine abrasive, that's why they are a little powdery.

I use Goddards Silver Dip. I believe that it converts the "rust" - silver oxide - which is the dirty stuff on your medal - back to metallic silver.

Dip medal in it for a few seconds, repeat if necessary with a little rubbing with soft cloth, and brush into crevices only if required with a WORN toothbrush (sharp square ends of bristles worn off ).

You would be surprised how quickly it comes clean - just seconds - bright and shiny.

Then rinse in hot water. Do not touch with your fingers from now on. Pat dry with soft cloth. Let air until fully dry. If desired buff to a high shine using just a plain dry untreated soft cotton cloth. Remember this is probably the one and only time this is going to happen to your medal.

Then I lacquer them. Heresy to some, but your medal, if handled gently will remain clean and shiny and should not require further treatment for decades.

For lacquer I use clear gloss nail varnish diluted approx 3 parts solvent 1 part nail varnish. (Apply with soft camel hair artists brush).

This solution is so thin it spreads over the surface almost by itself, very evenly and with no brush marks. Suspend by suspender, or ring, on a piece of thread.

If any surplus thinned lacquer forms a drop on bottom of suspended medal remove it immediately before it starts to harden, using soft cloth or tissue. Just touch it to the drop and let it soak off the medal - do not touch the medal.

Leave overnight to harden.

As the lacquer forms a barrier to prevent the oxygen in the air reacting again with the silver there should be no further tarnishing.

HANDLE WITH CARE - banging or rubbing against other medals will chip the lacquer and expose the silver to the air again. Not desirable !

You will find it almost impossible to see any lacquer.

Make it easy on yourself - do a bunch is medals at the same time....

Best of luck....... if you try this......

[Rundberg]

I do realize that there are different opinions about cleaning/not cleaning medals. And I do respect that the owner should do as he/she seems best.

But;

the day I win a trillion pounds on the lottery I´ll be on a mission to buy every gong in danger of being cleaned.

Cheers,

Chris

Edited March 4, 2010 by Rundberg

[Mervyn Mitton]

Chris - I must comment on your 'comment' - but only in a nice way ! You have no idea what people do to their medals - we recently took-in a board of some 30 good medals - everyone had been stuck to the felt mounting with glue. You have no choice other to clean them - and that involves nail polish remover to take the glue off. They came-up like new and with no damege - now, a few weeks down the line they are already darkening with the normal patina from unpolished silver. This happens very quickly.

[Rundberg]

Mervyn,

Even I would clean the medals in a situation like that.

Perhaps it´s just the old coincollector in me that makes me chill when I see "clean" and "medal" in the same sentence...

Slightly off topic if permitted?

Many years ago I worked in a large antiques- and coinshop and we got a call from a widow that wanted to sell her late husbands coin collection. We went there and was very impressed and gave her a fair offer of around £200000 in todays value. 2 days later we came with the money and the old lady had been "polite" and polished the coins quiet roughly.... I still remember how she cried when she was told what it had done to the value.

Regards,

Chris

[Mervyn Mitton]

Chris - a good warning - as you say ,always seek advice as Paddywhack did. Are you still in the Antique business ?

[Rundberg]

Unfortunately not, I started a career as a civil servant and as an academic´s union chairman instead. Nothing wrong with that but no way near as interesting...

I suppose we all make our mistakes...

But I´m all ears if you are in the business and thinking of opening a Swedish branch office.

Regards,

Chris

[Tony Farrell]

I think the patina looks quite attractive in this particular case. However, should you consider (professionally) repairing the cross and having a suspender attached, it might look a little out-of-place with fresh silver.

[paddywhack]

well iv been to hung over to actully clean it but if im half way with it this paddys day il give it a light cleaning in mild soapy water! by the way does anyone know where i can get an original suspension from??? :beer:

[Guest Darrell]

The jury is out and surprisingly many "would" clean (as in Tarnish Removing cleaning). I used to think that medals would look better "clean" and shiny, but am now in the group that says "leave as is".

Got this QSA a while back ... I guess some would cringe, some would go ? :cheers:

[Noor]

Darrell, I love your QSA

Paddy, as I said, don't do it! Owner of the MC can clean it and show it shiny when he wants but your duty is as a collector, preserve history and just respect it what age can do with some items.

[Chris Boonzaier]

I dunno,

some QSA etc have a patina from heaven... But sometimes that heavenly Patina is not as old as we think.

On occasion I have cleaned a silver medal and within 4-5 years it once again has that 100 year patina...