Solomon Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 Hello,This is my first real post on this board...I?ll show you the rarest highlight of my collection.Hope you enjoy it Order for Art and Science 2.class with oakleaves Principal Lippe-Detmold(Lippische Rose fuer Kunst und Wissenschaft 2.Klasse mit Eichenlaub Fuerstentum Lippe-Detmold)It was spent 9.June 1898 by Earl Ernst Casimir (Graf ERNST Casimir Friedrich Karl Eberhard Graf und Edler Herr zur Lippe-Biesterfeld 9.June 1842 - 26.September.1904)This order is made of silver, the thorns, the relief and the center on the back are painted golden.The white-red-white ribbon is the original ( This piece was given to a woman! )There were only 43 awards of this class , five of them came from the principal Lippe.This piece is an garanteed original (i?ve several pictures from other original orders to compare with)The relief in the middle and the letters around this relief indentify an original, if it doesn?t look exactely like mine, it is a copy! Actually i?m searching for the name of the woman, who awarded this order. At the end of this month i?ll visit a archive in Detmold ? they told me, that there i can find a list of all names...Greetings SolomonP.S. If you find any mistakes in my english, please correct it
Stogieman Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 Boys & Girls...... Please note the ribbon. It is rarely encountered!!
Solomon Posted February 4, 2006 Author Posted February 4, 2006 Boys & Girls...... Please note the ribbon. It is rarely encountered!! Yes, this right...it was even quite difficult to find pictures of other orders like this.I found it in two auction-catalogues (one was the auction of the collection of Paul Weweler in 1995, the famoust collector of orders, medals and coins from Lippe-Detmold).An email-contact with Mr. Nimmergut helped me too...I?ve to add some more information, i forgot in my first article:The order of the 1.class has a crown instead of the oakleaves and was awarded 34 times...The 3.class has none of them, the number of awards i haven?t found out yet.All classes have the same design of the rose. Greetings Solomon
David Gregory Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 Solomon,Excellent first real post! Nice to see you here and your English is much better than you think.I know you have a number of very interesting Lippe items and we all look forward to seeing them.David
joe campbell Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 soloman-a rare and beautiful piece,one to be proud of!joePS - that is a VERY attractive centerpieceto the medal!
Wild Card Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 (edited) Hi Solomon,Welcome to the forum. I want to thank you for your truly excellent presentation on the Lippe-Detmold Order for Arts and Science. It is an outstanding example of the unique design and superior workmanship that one often finds with the arts and science awards which I addressed in a recent thread.Again, welcome and best wishes,Wild Card Edited February 4, 2006 by Wild Card
Bob Hunter Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 I may be in error but I believe I have encountered that ribbon on a bar although I cannot identify the grade.
Stogieman Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 And Bob os quite correct. That's the one I was thinking of, which if memory serves is the ONLY example of this class on a ribbon bar we've ever seen!
Solomon Posted February 4, 2006 Author Posted February 4, 2006 Thank you for your very nice welcome on this board As David requested, i?ll show you some more nice awards of the principal Lippe-Detmold...@Bob I?m not sure, if the ribbon on your bar belongs to the shown order, but it is possible By the way, this bar seems to be from Saxony...the first ribbon surely belongs to a SEHO ( Saxe-Ernestine House Order ), the last ribbon might also be a Saxony-order or medal...GreetingsSolomon
Stogieman Posted February 4, 2006 Posted February 4, 2006 Hi Solomon, the last ribbon on Bob's bar is the Bulgarian Civil Merit Order.
Solomon Posted March 2, 2006 Author Posted March 2, 2006 Okay, gentlemen here a some information you can?t find in a book (but in the archive in Detmold, I visited today )There were only two manufactures of this rose:Richard Diller, Dresden (produced 1901-1914)He got the Order for art and science 3th class...C.F. Zimmermann (1917-1920) (only roses of the 1st class from Zimmermann are known!!!)Numbers of awards (according to the existing lists)1st class with the crown 34 awards2nd class with oakleaves 43 awards3th class with ring 130 awardsOnly 4 women awarded the order for art and science with oakleaves Lippe-Detmold: 1) 14.2.1906 Prevosti, Franceschina (opera-singer /Sopran)*13. 5. 1866 Livorno, died 28. 12. 1938 Camogli b. Genua2) 24.2.1911 Strandberg, Lilly geb. Wallenthin (art-name "Lilly Walleni" / opera-singer /Mezzosopran)*11. 8. 1875 Malm?, died 14. 5. 1920 Stockholm3) 24.2.1911 Kaempfert, Anna (opera-singer)* 25.5. 1877 Stuttgart, died ???4) 23.12.1917 Hirschfelder, Martha geb. Nauen (profession unknown)* 6.6.1868 Mainz, died ???I?m quite sure my rose belongs to the first woman (Franceschina Prevosti).This woman also got in 1904 the rose of the 3th class (She had to return the rose after she awarded the 2nd class). I know that the woman who awarded my rose, got also the order for art and science 3th class Schaumburg-Lippe.I found a document from this woman in which she said thank you to the Staatsministeium Lippe-Detmold and in which she mentioned the prince-regent from Schaumburg-Lippe.This is no evidence, but it is quite possible.GreetingsSolomon
Solomon Posted March 2, 2006 Author Posted March 2, 2006 (edited) ... Edited March 2, 2006 by Solomon
Solomon Posted March 2, 2006 Author Posted March 2, 2006 And here is a copy from a document (for the 3th class, but i?m sure the document for the other classes look similar)I have changed this document, i?m not allowed to show the original document, so i erased the name and the date.GreetingsSolomon
Solomon Posted June 23, 2006 Author Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) After a long research I can now offer you the person, who awarded these Orders for art an science 2nd class with oakleaves Lippe Detmold (?Lippische Rose 2.Klasse Lippe-Detmold)and the cross for art and science 2nd class Schaumburg Lippe (I showed it here: LINK).The only possible woman is the opera-singerLilly Walleni-Strandberg (born as Sanna Klara Valentin (-Strandberg))who was born in Malm?, 11. August 1875.She studied at the musical-college in Boston , returned to Swede in 1902 and went to Germany in 1908.From 1911 till 1917 she was employed at the opera in Hannover and became the title ?Fuerstlich Lippischische Kammersaengerin?.On 12. December 1913 she got the order for art and science 2nd class Schaumburg-Lippe.On 19. February 1914 she gave a concert at the castle of Detmold and the prince of Lippe-Detmold decorated her with the order of art and science 2nd class Lippe-Detmold (Lippische Rose) this day. The document for the ?Lippische Rose? she got on 11. March 1914 and she signed the receipt at the end of this month.In 1917 she returned to Stockholm, where she died on 14. May 1920.Both decorations of Lilly Walleni (there were no other awards from Lippe and Schaumburg-Lippe): Edited June 23, 2006 by Solomon
Solomon Posted June 23, 2006 Author Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) The entry of the award-list Schaumburg-Lippe: Edited June 23, 2006 by Solomon
Solomon Posted June 23, 2006 Author Posted June 23, 2006 Document from the "Lippisches Hofmarschallamt" that informs the "Lippisches Staatsministerium" about the award(s) the prince spent at the mentioned concert:
Solomon Posted June 23, 2006 Author Posted June 23, 2006 Her answer and her thanks to the prince of Lippe-Detmold:
Solomon Posted June 23, 2006 Author Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) I know, that there is another file with many documents in the archive of Hannover. There are also some photos of her (maybe with the order(s) ???).When I?ll find the time, I?ll also visit this archive and collect some more information.I hope you like my research. It was quite difficult, but now I?m proud the result, which gives my very rare orders a name. GreetingsSolomon Edited June 23, 2006 by Solomon
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