Luftwaffe Fallschirmsch?tzenabzeichen.

[Frank M]

Some exceptionally fine badges displayed here by a plethora of individuals. Thank you all for sharing your items with us.

Respectfully,

Frank

Edited April 28, 2006 by Frank M

[PKeating]

Not strictly Luftwaffe although the prewar ones were worn by former Heer paras in the Luftwaffe. The three basic types of issue Heer FSA: (L-R) Type 1 and Type 2b (1937/38) in aluminium and Type 3 (1943/44) in feinzink.

PK

[PKeating]

A better view of the Type 1 "extended talon" FSA (Heer) by C E Juncker, the only known factory-engraved aluminium version. Clearly Obergefreiter Sell couldn't or wouldn't extend to an engraved 800 silver private purchase badge. This is the badge that illustrates the cover of Eric Queen's book on the Heer FJ, Red Shines The Sun, published by Roger Bender. The FIK/FIB became part of the Luftwaffe as II./Fallschirmj?ger-Regiment 1 on 1.1.1939 and former Fallschirm-Infanterie Kompanie/Bataillon men wore their Heer badges throughout the war, despite being issued with LW versions in 1943.

PK

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Gentlemen

Will add mine here if its ok, any opinions??

Good or Bad will be appreciated

Kevin in Deva. sorry I cannot upload bigger pictures

[Kev in Deva]

Hallo Gentlemen

Will add mine here if its ok, any opinions??

Good or Bad will be appreciated

Kevin in Deva. sorry I cannot upload bigger pictures

Edited April 28, 2006 by Kev in Deva

[Jan Arne S]

PK !

I just love those Heeres Para Badge !

Neil !

A lot of Very very Nice LW para`s You got there !

Wounder who got the Heeres Para that Carsten B had for sale a couple of Weeks ago .

Just remembered I had a Juncker LW Para in a other Thread , I move it over here as well .

JanA rne

Edited May 1, 2006 by Jan Arne S

[Jan Arne S]

Back of Juncker LW Para .

Jan Arne

[Les]

My primary area of interest is Imperial German collecting, and for the most part, don't collect TR era items. I have -one- Fj/abzeichen in my collection. I bought it with an "ulterior" motive in mind.

My father's first cousin was an Fj. He volunteered for the Lw in 1942, when he was 18. Kurt was jump-trained during the later part of 1942, and sent to France in 1943 and took part in trying to fend off the allied invasion of Normandy. He fought at St. Lo, survived the escape through the Falaise Gap, and was at Arnhem when -that- little dust up there took place. Late in October 44, he was wounded in the foot and hospitalized at Magdeburg, and then moved when the Russians were closing in on Berlin later in the war. He was still in hospital at the end of the war, and stuck in a French POW cage. He kept his Fj/abzeichen through six months of being in a French camp, and was released after being declared unfit to work. He still has his badge (and his EKII ribbon)...minus the pin on the back. He managed to keep the badge through numerous searches and items being seized or confiscated by breaking of the pin, and placing it between the butt-cheeks whenever an inspection or search seemed imminent.

These days the badge is oxidized a bit, but I know where it's been, who owned it, and the family connection. I'm trying to work an open trade with my father's cousin. He's ammenable to passing it on, but doesn't seem inclined to part with something that obviously meant a great deal to him not only then, but now.

Meanwhile, I'm planning on giving him this and hoping to get his in "due time."

My only Fj badge, a "B & N".....the front:

Les

[Les]

...and the reverse...this one with pin attached.

Les

[J Temple-West]

A great story, Les. Not the first time I've heard about the POW's favoured place of concealment. On Inspection days it must have looked like Monty Python's "Ministry of silly walks."

As to the badge you want to give him....At first, from the obverse, I thought...B&NL. The reverse has me scratching my head though. I think we need to take a closer look. Rivets look good but the way the catch is attached is certainly atypical for a Badge by this maker and I wondering if it's a repair. B&NL has, as far as I know, always used a recessed catch, or could this be an early form of catch attachment.

A closeup of the catch area + a side view of the hinge and wreath would help.

Other opinions?

[Reini]

That's very interesting. I like the B&NL badge. Here is a zink Assmann O/G I recently acquired , made in the old aluminum mold. It has exactly the same hook and rivets to my eyes. What do you think?

Best

Kurt

[Reini]

the hook...it looks very close , if not exact. Maybe this was an earlier hook that reappeared because of the old mold?

[Reini]

And the rivets seem to have the same raised circle in the center.

[Reini]

and the other.

[Les]

Here's one of the reverse, showing the base of the clasp. The hook isn't attached in the usual way. It might have been broken, and repaired? I don't know all that much about these....

Les

[Les]

..and one more. The file was a little too large to include with the previous post. You can clearly see the cone of excess material at the base of the hook. The hook is too large and high, and doesn't hold the pin in place very well.

Does the pin look correct for a B&N L ? My impressions when I saw it was that the catch was probably repaired although I'm not saying it might not be a fake. One Lw/Fj collector that saw it thought the catch was a repair, and offered to trade a duplicate badge he had for this one.

TR stuff is something that's outside my area, and something I might look at once or twice, but not with the intention of buying for my collection.

Ok...good...or bad?

Les

[J Temple-West]

Hi Les,

Thanks for the extra pix. Seeing that this example has a sheet metal hinge, I will put my neck on the block and say that this badge has to be put down as a fake.

Reasons:

Recently there has been some controversy regarding another B&NL badge, this being the ?Claw foot? flak badge. Although generally accepted at correct (having the right hinge, recessed catch etc) there is a fake of the same badge which has the same hinge as your Para. I can only assume that the maker?s of this fake flak badge have also made your badge. Not proof positive, by any means, but would explain the inconsistencies.

I?ve compiled a compilation of the various hinge styles.

[Les]

..... Although generally accepted at correct (having the right hinge, recessed catch etc) there is a fake of the same badge which has the same hinge as your Para. I can only assume that the maker?s of this fake flak badge have also made your badge. Not proof positive, by any means, but would explain the inconsistencies.

Thanks for the comparative photos. I see the difference(s) and understand your points. I'm inclined to agree with you, and after thinking about your comments and looking at the badge further don't think you're sticking your neck out on this one.

The shape of the pin has a "foot" or projection to prevent the pin from being depressed too far. On the badge however, the look of the pin is betrayed by the lack of that function being workable. There's nothing for the foot or projection to come in contact with so the pin is able to pushed all the way down until it contacts the back of the badge. In some ways, it's like a having a wrongly sized door that doesn't match the door frame size and the door doesn't close the way the design was intended. Also, the pin/catch feature is far too loose. These "details" had me wondering if the badge was nothing more than a decent looking fake.

I'd planned on giving this to my father's cousin, but now that it's not likely to be a real badge, I'm seriously thinking of finding one that is real. It seems flat out wrong to me, to give a vet, and a relative something that's not real.

Les

[ERIC]

This one just in - an S&L CUPAL example!

ERIC

[attachmentid=37977]

[ERIC]

Reverse:

[attachmentid=37978]

[ERIC]

Side Views:

[attachmentid=37979] [attachmentid=37980]

[ERIC]

Another view:

[attachmentid=37981]

[Jan Arne S]

Hi Eric !

Nice LW Para badge .

Is both the eagle and whreat kupal or only the Eagle ?

Jan Arn e

[Kev in Deva]

Hi Guys, I see nobody made any comments about my badge, Post 204 & 205

...er...hopefully ..... the silence doesnt mean its an out and out fake??

Kevin in Deva in anticipation of a reply good or bad or indifferent

[ERIC]

Hi Eric !

Nice LW Para badge .

Is both the eagle and whreat kupal or only the Eagle ?

Jan Arn e

Hi Jan,

Thanks! Only the eagle is CUPAL , the wreath is zinc.

ERIC