Soviet HSL

[Bob]

Occasionally I've seen some HSL stories which are easy to understand why it's valued so exceptionally in USSR: researching nuclear weapons for instance.

But what I then don't get is all the HSLs (e.g. on one of the dealer websites with 2 Order of Lenins attached to it) for "mere" farming. Must be a one hellofa HUGE farm...

[Ed_Haynes]

Hard to say. While so many so thoroughtly denigrate the HSL --

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=2735

-- maybe what it represents was, in the final analysis, maybe more important for the greater daily welfare of the people of the CCCP than were the deeds of the poor unfortunate (however heroic) who was by dumb luck the first across some bridgehead in Poland?

A defender of the civilian awards checking in here . . . .

Edited April 16, 2006 by Ed_Haynes

[Vatjan]

A defender of the civilian awards checking in here . . . .

I'm with you Ed, Labour awards are generally neglected, whatever country they come from.

It takes some hard work, not to mention getting up early, to make us our daily bread, your car won't run smoothly if someone didn't get his hands dirty while working on it,...

Workers of the world unite!!!..

Oops... getting a little carried away

Just to say I like civilian medals as well.

Jan

[NavyFCO]

From another fan of labor awards...

TO be an HSL was a HUGE honor in the USSR. So, I would assume that in order to be given the title, you had to do something pretty spectacular - even if it was having a lot (a LOT) of pigs on your farm!

I do think it funny that most people won't even give a second glance to civilian labor awards, or a group of awards to a "non-combat" military guy. Getting back research for an award (no matter how high) to a logistics guy is a death knell for the saleability of the piece, so often times this kind of research tends to "dissapear" (yep, that's true!) in order for the group to bring a better value.

But, what people who aren't familiar with the military and it's interworkings forget is that for every one person to be on the front, it took dozens of people behind the scenes making sure he had a uniform, a gun, food, ammunition, gasoline and the like! Imagine a soldier and how well he could fight in the modern world if he had to get his own food, provide his own uniform and use a knife! Sometimes those "unglamourous" people deserve the 51% of the credit for great military victories!

Dave

[Guest Rick Research]

The thing to realize is that these were POLITICAL awards. As such, they were bestowed--and well publicized most of the time-- for political reasons.

Unlike most awards in most places, there were actual concrete benefits to being a Hero that in a state controlled economy actually meant something for the living conditions of the recipient's immediate family.

There were always cycles to Soviet awards--

the gargantuan surge of Badges of Honor in 1966-67,

the tidal wave of Labor Glories 3rd Class from April to June 1978

and so on

which without question meant that EARLIER deeds that got nothing for the self-same whatever it was were slighted, as were later awards that also never happened because of such previous mass bestowals.

The needs of the Soviet system produced these "volcanic eruptions" in civil/economic awards, not any more or less worthiness in the toiling masses.

The disregard for this title is doubtless tied to the awards inflation of the 1950s, when Lenins were handed out by the quarter million for mere long service and devaluing THAT award-- so a Labor Hero was bumped down to compensate for the Lenin's plummet in prestige.

There was certainly an unbridgable gap between a 1940s Labor Gold Star and those subsequent, and I'd certainly place far more "value" (in a non-monetary sense) on a LATE Labor Hero award than on one from the 1950s.

So...

"it all depends." A 1944 one? A 1954 one? A 1974 one? Well, THAT would depend on whether it was one that Brezhnev gave to himself or not!

[Stogieman]

Interesting discussion. I was advised to steer clear of civil pieces and civil groups..... But having a HSL is a more obtainable goal right now than a HSU.

[Guest Rick Research]

That's because it is possible to RESEARCH (knock on wood, long may it continue and prosper) military awards but NOT civil ones. You would need the Big And Little Labor Gold Star Books because only the "Big" one even gives a one line reason for the award. The "normal" Orders Book is as useless as any other Orders Book for figuring out who and what the recipient was.

And a "loose" Labor Hero is hopeless.

[Bob]

I imagine that the fact that a labour award (in this case: HSL) really only offers 2-3 lines of explanation has something to do with it vs. military awards with more lenghty descriptions of what, where, when. Then again, into what detail is it relevant to go for a pig farmer? If you've taken care of 1 pig, you've taken care of a million pigs in a sense.

The truly exceptional "workers" would have gotten a state prize instead of a HSL?

[NavyFCO]

That's because it is possible to RESEARCH (knock on wood, long may it continue and prosper) military awards but NOT civil ones.

But alas! It is! You must have forgotten!

You just HAVE to have the Ukaz date in order to get a copy of the Ukaz then any of the associated newspaper coverage of the award. That's how we've found out about the school teachers getting their awards at X and X times and so on. Unfortunately, the later ones are a bit tougher to research - I just bought a group with a Lenin/Oct Rev/2 RBL and Honor Order from the 1970s, but the chances of that being researchable are slim... but worth it to me!

One of my greatest research boons was a beaut of a Heroic Labor medal which came back as researched to a worker on the USSR-Iran railway line for lend lease goods. Pretty darn cool, I think - and 100% civil.

Now Rick, what you should do is make an accessable database of all the known civil awards, numbers and Ukaz dates so we can try to pin down who-was-awarded-what-when... Now that would be something!

Dave

[order_of_victory]

My HSL No. 7925 doesnt have its large award book, it has its Order Book with photo, so it wont be reasarchable but I dont mind I just like the Order.

But I still cant belive how small it is

[Ed_Haynes]

As Dave has reminded us, research is often possible for civil awards, though I'm not sure we want this too widely known, so that the fascinating civil groups will remain less desianble and still within the reach of those of us who know their myriad joys.

All awards are, of course, ultimately "political". The decision who got what aware is occasionally influenced by the merits of the deed, but more commonly -- in any state, any era -- what we may see as extraneous political concerns come in. It may just be a matter of rewarding what is valued in a given society: for the British high birth, for the Soviets cow-milking, for the USA, well, nothing, etc.