Mike McLellan

Quite an impressive ribbon. That number will be critical in either finding your man, or confirming his identity once you narrow your search down by slogging through the archives at Kew. The number itself is a bit of a puzzle. Is it 1090 ? Or 16905 or...? I think it’s traceable, but it’ll take some detective work. Start with the London Gazette Archives. Good luck! Mike By the way, Wessel, the Victory Medal was not an American medal exclusively.

Thanks, Mike. The added E looks rather crudely done. The owner might have felt that identifying the squadron was as important as identifying the individual. Certainly a team player. Was this squadron particularly notable in any of its exploits? Mike.

Thanks for posting, G. I don’t know why, but I expected to see greater similarities between your number 1 and Bob’s oak truncheon. Given the rush for equipment, early on, I expected that there would exist a template or some means of ensuring uniformity of equipment. At the time, there were 1.5 million people in greater London, and I’m certain there were more than a few wood turners among them. Anyway, more questions than answers. The adage, “The more we know, the less we know” is apropos. Thanks again. Mike.

Nice. Your collection is very similar to mine. I think a tackle box will not do justice to such a nice assortment. A tackle box, although it may contain treasures that we collectors cherish, will be seen as just a box of junk to others, especially our spouses. I don't have a man-cave either, or any room that I can devote to my personal interests. I found that if you confine your junk to one small organized area, like a nice cabinet or a box type picture frame, your collection can become a relevant part of the family and although your spouse may snort every time she walks by it, even she will have to admire its aesthetic beauty. You might find a suitable cabinet or frame at a second-hand or antique shop. If you're handy, you can add depth to a nice frame with bits of wood, or build one outright. It has to look halfway decent to pass muster in a typical household, so take your time and keep your eyes peeled when you visit the landfill.

Very nice additions to your collection, Bob. The oak truncheon is fascinating. I would expect early Met stocks to be stamped by the maker, Parker @ Holborn. This one is clearly not from that firm. Yet, the MP Crown stamp is proof positive that it spent part of its life with the Metropolitan Police regardless of its initial origin. Even the scratched initials give it added character. Both of them are great sticks. The WR IV one really tugs at the limits of our imaginations, especially as it does have the Parker stamp. Really, really nice group that you’ve put together. I think a family photo might be in order. Thanks Alan, for dropping by. Always a source of quality information. I think some photos of your collection would add much to our learning. Cheers, Mike. Bob, As an afterthought, I took another look at G’s oak truncheon. It’s quite similar to your stick. Maybe, if he reads this, he can post a view of the butt end of his truncheons, we could make a better comparison.

Thanks muchly. Mike

All right brother. I googled “BNA” and the only hit I got was the Nashville Airport. Was this guy a singer at the Grand Ole Opry? Seriously, what is BNA? I like to cruise around various sites, especially if they’re relevant to this hobby of ours. Thanks. Mike.

Hello Arne. As this jacket is presently being offered for sale on EBay as that of Sir Colin Wood, what makes you conclude that it is the jacket of CC Sir Peter Matthews? Mike

That is a really nice stick, Bob. I’m jealous. More and more, I find my interest drawn to the era of policing prior to the establishment of the organized forces, especially the Public Office period. Artifacts from that time are among the scarcest of the scarce, and your truncheon is an important and valuable representative. Very, very cool! The number 55 provides food for thought as well. How many truncheons were on hand at the time, and how many men could be mustered for any given event. There had to have been some kind of organization, as well as some semblance of a rank structure. Alan Cook has a new book that, I think, covers that period, but I have not yet been able to get a copy and read it. Thanks for posting the photos, and congratulations on a fine acquisition. Mike.

Hello Bob. You’ve given us lots to think about! There are some experts on truncheons around here, but sadly, I’m not one of them. I am, however, an avid student with a voracious appetite for information on Metropolitan Police historical insignia and equipment. I can only guess at the mysteries that your sticks present. The lighting in the first photo makes the printing difficult to read. Along with your ideas, I would be tempted to add “Schin—-“ to the possibilities. A lot of research possibilities to explore. That other truncheon is also fascinating. I wonder if somebody dug that thing out of retirement to serve with the Fenian unpleasantness in 1868. There seems to be a lot of truncheons in existence that commemorate that particular date. A wonderful historical artifact either way. You’ve dropped a hint that the POHG truncheon is coming your way. If so, congratulations! Another great piece of history. Be sure to post pictures as well as your ideas about these pieces. Thanks for joining in, and keep us posted. Mike.

A beauty indeed. I doubt if anyone will ever find another one like it. Do you plan on repurposing it or displaying it a certain way?

I don’t know about that bullet. Are you sure that the primer is inert? Mike

Yikes! In my last post, I cited information contained in Alan Cook’s book on truncheons, and referred to him as Alan Clark. My apologies to Mr. Cook. Mike

Thank you, gentlemen. Appreciated muchly. Mike.

There is currently a truncheon being offered by Clarke’s Auctions at Semley that is relevant to my original question about early Met sticks. It is painted black with POHG in gilt with MP crown in at least 3 locations. I feel safe in presuming that this was a truncheon from Hatton Garden Public Office that was inherited by the Met when they absorbed the public offices upon their inception. An identical stick is in Alan Clark’s book. A rare truncheon indeed, if authentic. My high bid was instantly outbid by another. I hope that whoever gets it posts some good pictures. I asked the auction house if the firm of Parker of Holborn is indicated on the butt end, but have not heard anything as yet. I’m no longer a participant in this feeding frenzy, but I wish you the best of luck if you are.

Go to Ebay and search for “Special Constabulary Ribbon”. I just checked, and there are several to choose from. Mike.

Thanks guys. Approximately when did the Met approve the PR-24 or the steel expandable? Any thoughts on why they thought that a change was needed? PR-24s were introduced at my facility in the early ‘90s. They could only be carried (or used) by sergeants, and only those sergeants who had passed the qualification final exam, which was impossible without considerable practice. As I recall, only two sergeants were qualified to use them. I was not one of them. They fell out of favor in less than a year, and were withdrawn from service.

Sometimes I get so wrapped up in historical trivia, that I’m oblivious to what’s going on around me. What type of truncheon is now being used by the Metropolitan Police? Is it the expandable steel baton? Was the PR-24 ever in general use? When did they stop using the familiar wooden truncheon? Why? Are the other UK forces on the same page? I would appreciate any opinions, regardless of how flawed they might seem. Thanks, Mike.

Yes, I’ve pretty much ruled out the entire Victorian era, which includes the City of London Police, as well. What’s left is a cesspool of possibilities, many of them somewhat bizarre.

Very nice, and not so crazy. Mike.

We have all, at one time or another, paid more for a piece than our colleagues (or wives) thought it was worth. Over time, value seems to catch up with the price we paid. There is much truth to the adage that says we have not paid too much, just purchased a bit too early. Nice ribbon. Mike.

Thanks Alan. I’m hoping that Officer Horne turns out to be a copper. With a generic term like “officer” though, he could be any one in a cadre of city officials. Thanks again. Mike.

Hello. I've had this tipstaff for a couple of years, and I need some help. My limited resources, and my limited expertise of those resources, keep me tumbling into dead-end tunnels. I think the era of this particular tipstaff is pre-Victorian, just because of it's shape and size ( 7 inches ). It is engraved, " City of London ". It also has the word "Officer" and named to George Horne on either side of the London arms. I've had no luck with the Old Bailey site or any of the other paths that I've stumbled onto. If someone can lend a hand to an elderly gentleman, I would be very appreciative. I was hoping to attribute it to the City of London Police or one of the Wards of the city, but it seems that tipstaves were passed out to anybody with some authority. Where can I search to learn anything about George Horne? Thanks, Mike

All good points, G. A lot of information can be gleaned from the early police orders, if one has the patience to search through them. My experience has been that they provide a somewhat skewed ratio of answers to questions. That’s the nature of research, though. You seem to have a good handle on them. Nice job. Mike.

Nice. So, without the MP (or CP) stamp, do you think that this is another once-painted stick? Pretty clean if it is. Very cool truncheon either way. Mike.