David Gregory

As you can see, the only mark is "Godet Berlin" on the pin. From the feel of it in my hand and the nice dark patina, I assume it has a very high silver content. [attachmentid=24444] The image below shows Leutnant der Reserve Rau of Mecklenburgisches Grenadier-Reiment Nr. 89 proudly wearing his EK1 and Mecklenburg-Schwerin MVK 1st class on the left, and an as yet unidentified fellow officer probably of II. Bataillon wearing his EK1 and Mecklenburg-Strelitz 1st class cross. The picture was probably taken during a parade held behind the Somme front in the second half of 1916. [attachmentid=24446]

The reverse also displays a few signs of being knocked around. [attachmentid=24443]

OK, I confess. I got it. If you want to get that special item on Detlev Niemann's Friday update, you have to be quick and you need a certain amount of luck. Last Friday was like Christmas come early for me. In order not to tempt fate, I don't normally talk about items in my collection until I have actually received them from the seller. I hope you will understand why I didn't mention anything until now. Here is the cross that I have been looking for for some time. To be honest, I really didn't think I would ever find one as described by Hessenthal & Schreiber with the two hooks on either side of the pin. It has obviously seen a certain amount of wear and tear. [attachmentid=24442]

Kevin, It looks like all of the documents are certified transcripts compiled to document his records for future service in the Bundeswehr. They might not appeal to some collectors because they are not pre-1945, but I consider them to be an interesting variant. I think they certainly belong in a good document collection. This form of certified transcript has been standard practice for military and civilian documents in Germany for many years (I have pre-1918 documents, for example) and are still widely used today. David

Can these PlM copies be bought anywhere as copies and at prices below $1000?

The F.d.R.d.A. abbreviation beneath the stamp stands for F?r die Richtigkeit der Angaben, which suggests that the document is a transcript or certified copy, the contents of which are certified as being correct by the signer. It may have been produced in lieu of the missing or never isued original document to replace or supplement lost records, perhaps for a war pension.

This award is one that I have been trying to find for some time. By a supreme effort of self-discipline (at least for me), I passed on the one shown by Steve at the start of the thread and convinced myself to wait for a wartime piece, or at least one with the two hooks as described by Hessenthal & Schreiber, to come my way one day. In the meantime, I will just have to do with the one I showed in post #7. Is Godet known to have made any pin-backs (I'm thinking more in terms of EKs) with the extra hooks after 1918?

I don't collect Soviet items, but I am a sucker for document groups with the associated medals and personal photos, etc. Very nice!

Paul, The red/white/blue ribbon in the middle is one (of a few) that I need for a British 1914-15 Star. If no one else geographically closer to you needs it, I would be pleased to give it a new home. Please let me know if you are looking for any German ribbons, as I might have a spare bit of one you are looking for. Cheers, David

Some more views of the pin arrangement of the first cross when it was in my hands: [attachmentid=24095] [attachmentid=24096]

Jens, I had the first cross shown above for a few weeks last year. I think I know the fake crosses you mean, which I had the opportunity to inspect at Kassel, and although the images posted by Steve might seem similar, the ones I handled are certainly not the same. These side and oblique views of the pin arrangement show the difference. I cannot comment on the second cross. David [attachmentid=24092] [attachmentid=24093] [attachmentid=24094]

Stogieman, I agree. The absence of any real equivalents means that the list I posted above will have to be regarded as personal preference, as I pointed out. Few states had awards with remotely similar criteria to the Iron Cross. Dave Danner suggested the following criteria as a starting point: a military decoration in two classes (1st/2nd class, pin-back and suspended from a ribbon)a military decoration awarded to officers and enlisted men without regard to ranka basic military decoration of the particular German stateA combination of these criteria mean that only the Mecklenburg and Oldenburg crosses stand any sort of comparison. Braunschweig came close, but the 1st class cross appeared very late in the war. Lippe-Detmold doesn't really fit as the pin-back and cross suspended from a ribbon were two different awards, even if they looked alike. The Schaumburg-Lippe pin-back cross was intended for members of the ruling house only, so it doesn't really match, either. Some states had an award that was open to all ranks, other states distinguished between officers on the one hand, and NCOs/other ranks on the other. The Bavarian MVK came in six different flavours depending on rank, for example, although the rarity of some of them excludes them from my list. The Thuringian duchies offer too many possibilities and there are no real equivalents. Loose application of the criteria above and personal preference (reflected by rarity/affordability) resulted in this list, which suits me as a framework of what I would like to collect as representative examples of the bravery awards bestowed by the various German states between 1914 and 1918. They are also the awards typically entered in the Milit?rp?sse, Soldb?cher and other papers that I collect. I emphasise the fact that my criteria are loosely applied, since I forgot to add the silver St. Henry medal as an approximate EK1 equivalent, which could just as easily be included as many other awards. Does anyone else collect in the same way, e.g. basic bravery/merit awards of the various states? David

Joe, The approximate equivalents of the Iron Cross are also a theme which I collect, whereby my loose definition is largely a matter of personal preference and affordability. While my collecting focus is mainly on service records, personal papers and award documents roughly from 1914 to 1918, I also try to acquire representative examples of combattant awards to go with them or complete groups. The awards that I loosely consider to be Iron Cross equivalents are based on an idea suggested elsewhere by Dave Danner. He pointed out that there were no really true equivalents to the Iron Cross, since a two-class cross award system is limited to only a few states. His requirement was that they be the basic award of the state, generally considered a prerequisite for higher awards and usually open to both officers and enlisted men. As he explained, the awards of some states did not meet these criteria. He also pointed out another important aspect, which I consider a reasonable exclusion factor: The list below is closely based on Dave Danner's definition with a few changes made to suit my personal preferences: Anhalt - FriedrichkreuzBaden - Verdienstmedaille am Bande des MKFVOsBayern - various grades of MVK (NCOs, other ranks) and MVO (officers)Braunschweig - Kriegsverdienstkreuz (1st & 2nd classes)Bremen - HanseatenkreuzHamburg - HanseatenkreuzHessen - Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen "F?r Tapferkeit", Krieger-Ehrenzeichen in Eisen (rare, but nevertheless included in my list)Hohenzollern - FHHO (officers), goldene Ehrenmedaille mit Schwertern and silberne Verdienstmedaille mit Schwertern (NCOs, other ranks)Lippe-Detmold - Kriegsehrenkreuz, KriegsverdienstkreuzSchaumburg-Lippe - Kreuz f?r Treue DiensteL?beck - HanseatenkreuzMecklenburg-Schwerin - Milit?rverdienstkreuz (1st & 2nd classes)Mecklenburg-Strelitz - Kreuz f?r Auszeichnung im Kriege (1st & 2nd classes)Oldenburg - Friedrich August-Kreuz (1st & 2nd classes)Preu?en - Eisernes Kreuz (1st & 2nd classes)Reuss - Ehrenkreuz (officers) & goldene/silberne Verdienstmedaille mit Schwertern (NCOs, other ranks); Reuss' pinback KVK seems too rareSachsen - Albrechtsorden (officers), Friedrich-August-Medaillen (NCOs and other ranks)Sachsen-Weimar - White Falcon (officers), allgemeines Ehrenzeichen mit Bandschnalle und Schwertern (NCOs, other ranks); Wilhelm-Ernst Kriegskreuz is too rare for meSachsen-Altenburg - many possibilities: SEHO and associated medals; Herzog Ernst Medaille (1st class cross too rare for me); Tapferkeitsmedaille (the basic award by my definition)Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha - same as Altenburg: SEHO (as above); oval silver Herzog Carl Eduard-Medaille; Carl-Eduard Kriegskreuz is too rare for meSachsen-Meiningen - Kreuz (officers) and Medaille (NCOs and other ranks) f?r Verdienste im KriegeSchwarzburg-Rudolstadt und Sonderhausen - Silbermedaille f?r Verdienste im Kriege (the basic award by my definition)Waldeck - Verdienstkreuz and associated VerdienstmedaillenW?rttemberg - MVO or Friedrichs-Orden mit Schwertern (officers); Milit?rverdienstmedaillen (NCOs, other ranks)The above awards, either as single items, two-piece combinations of the Iron Cross and the state award, or three-piece combinations of the Iron Cross plus state award and Hindenburg cross, form an achievable (and mostly affordable) sub-category and complement the documents that are the main theme of my collection. A few other merit and home service awards could also be added to the list, such as Hessen's Milit?r-Sanit?ts-Kreuz 1914, an example of which I have finally obtained (thanks Tony) to match an award entry in a Milit?rpass to a Sanit?ter, but they are not really basic awards in my opinion. David

Chip, Is "51.R.5.C.54." a standard code for marking property? RIR 51 and 5. Kompagnie (or 5. Compagnie using an older spelling) make sense to me. Does the "54" stand for the soldier's number on the company roll or is it simply an issue number for the item? Thanks in advance, David

Chris, Take a look at http://www.jonsmith-modellbau.com/ where you might find the figure saw. I've got two of his kits stashed away for when I try my hand at modelling again some time in the distant future. David

Has anybody bought items from German eBay seller sammler241 in the past? He is currently offering some pieces that bear a striking similarity in terms of their rather featureless dark finish, which does not inspire confidence in me. Your opinions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, David

Steve, That looks like a standard Reichswehr buckle as used until the early to mid thirties, when it was replaced by the version with the bent cross. David

Hi Claudio, Thanks for the reply. The rare MVO is not what I meant, but rather the white cross next to it. It looks like something from Finland to me, but I admit that I know next to nothing about these awards. I would never have guessed a Hungarian award, whatever it might be. David

Which cross is he wearing immediately below the EK1 in the picture above?

Joel, You are right. It was issued by a veterans association as a commomorative piece. David

Christophe, A wonderful group which seems to belong to a Landsturm man from Hamburg! In post #3 the shoulder strap seems to show battalion number 29. Can you read the corps district number in roman numerals? Do you have any indications of which Landsturm unit(s) he served with? David

Stogie, An interesting trench picture indeed. Images of rifle grenades being fired from stands to hold the rifle sell for very high prices on German eBay. Trench images tend to be expensive in any case. A postcard showing a group of men with hand grenades and cudgels sold for just over EUR 100 today in auction #6241636149. I think I have an example of the same card which cost me a couple of Marks at a flea market a few years back. David

Paul, A basic knowledge of German is essential if you want to be able to read stuff like this. The more documents you have, the easier it becomes. I have reached the point where I have started compiling a database of the documents I have because I simply cannot keep track of them any more. Even if you only ever acquire a few document groups such as this and do your best to find out something about the people that they once belonged to, you will begin to understand what all those otherwise anonymous pieces of shiny metal and enamel really represent. The gongs are certainly nice to have, but the people that earned them are the reason why I collect militaria. Cheers, David

I know what you mean, Chris. In my youth I used to make quite passable models and enjoyed detailing and modifying them. I have solved the space problem in my old age by keeping the kits I have bought in recent years in their boxes. One day ..... I'll have enough time to build some of them.

Very nice comparison and an unusual and interesting core/frame combination. I think I need to find a decent scanner and spend even more time at the computer!