Ed_Haynes

Nice thread, thanks. So much more interesting than those BORING Nazi things!

Yes, but there was no eBay after the war with Argentina.

Lucky bustard.

From what I have seen in the press, a fair number of British veterans of the Iraq invasion are selling their medals as a modest form of protest against this very unpopular deployment. Supply and demand has worked to keep prices high, for now, but as more Iraq medals are coming to market the prices are sure to drop.

No, Chuck, give it to us here. We can take it. (Grrrr.) "Take it", and we hope "answer it". Do we get points for effort??

The research would be awesome to behold! For what it is, I'm not sure the price is unreasonable. For this, I think you look into selling family members.

Welcome aboard, Alexei! Good to see you here. You'll see some familiar goodies on various threads, I'm sure. Ed

Actually, I found them. Fax off tomorrow.

Bob, Do you happen to have their address and fax number? By PM if preferred . . . ??? Ed

Good start, 2 down, 52 (at last count) to go! Mine are on other threads here or over at: http://sagongs.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=70 I only ("only") have 45 to add!

All I have for comparison is a Bulgarian Hero of Socialist Labor / Geroj na sotsialistitjeskija trud. See over at: http://www.omsa.org/photopost/showphoto.ph...oto=287&cat=548 Came cased together with the Order of Georgi Dimitrov / Orden Georgi Dimitrov and document. But I can't guarantee they're 100% genuine. Guess nothing is certain in these days? The pair (?) can be seen at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=3778

"The Book" will have the full rundown on what Indian regiments served in the ICSC in Vietnam, in Laos, and in Cambodia. Usually, only an officer would have any reason to wear miniatures, an officer or maybe a mess servant. The long service medals didn't come in until 1971, by which time he'd have acquired several others. Almost everyone in the Indian military gets a Sainya Seva whether they want one or not. Until the "Andaman and Nicobar" clasp came along, the standing joke was that the only way to avoid the medal was to join the navy. I have never seen a complete group (except with recipients). Even single ICSC medals are scarce, same for the Videsh Seva with "Hindchin" clasp; I've never seen even a pair in close on to 30 (!) years.

Miniatures and the clasps that go with them are manufactured by the military tailors with not much concern over official designs (even though there are official "sealed patterns" for miniatures held in the Ministry of Defence Medal Office). In fact, I can look at these and tell you who made and mounted them (Army Equippers, Connaught Place, New Delhi). The language of the miniature clasps means nothing. They are seen in Hindi, in English, interchangably, and with random claps (like "PAKISTAN 1965" that never existed -- though I have seen this one more commonly on the Samar Seva Star where it REALLY doesn't belong). To reiterate: there is NO political message at all in the English clasps. Rarely do the legends on any clasps match the real clasps on the full-sized medals. And I have NEVER seen a miniature Videsh Seva Medal with the correct design. Yes, this rogue miniature clasp probably represents "Kachh-Kargil" on the Samanya Seva Medal. Miniatures (in any country) are, after all, only unofficial things and represent the myriad fantasies of the manufacturers and marketers. This is an interesting little Indian miniature group, with no more than normal deviance, for someone who served in the ICSC (a fascinating and relatively scarce entitlement) and then in the pre-war and wartime conflicts in the 1965 war with Pakistan. I'd bet we are seeing a group for a junior officer (captain, maybe?), perhaps in the Dogra Regiment. The only surprising thing about the group is that he somehow avoided a Sainya Seva Medal! Now: Where are the real medals that these miniatures try to represent??? (PS- I have intentionally stopped ANY updating on my website on Indian medals -- http://faculty.winthrop.edu/haynese/india/medals/INDMED.html -- in part because a book is due out "soon" but also because this material -- and material from my other websites -- has been blantantly and freely stolen for others' use -- including publication in major phaleristic journals -- and I have no intent to feed the thieves any more!)

So many of the sites out there may have nice images, but are incredibly short on information. Even Megan's site has little, and we are left going back to Dorling and Wehrlich. Dave's sites (thank you!) are the exception to the rule, but their focus is where their focus is. And (apologies), how could I forget Yuri Yashnev's superb site (well, it was down the last time I looked, maybe that's why): http://www.netdialogue.com/yy/Africa/AfricaMain.htm We do need a good and carefully researched book on African awards.

Yes, I'd assume that most would have gone to friendly Warsaw Pact countries or to places like North Korea and, thereby, vanished because no one knew or cared what they were. Ever worse for the documents, I fear. A few probably would have gone to Mongolians involved in international relations (though, on quick glance, I can't find any in Battushig). As I understand it, the Medal of Brotherhood in Arms (# A 59, sorry I don't know the Mongolian name) was awarded on a more balanced basis.

PS: We also have a few (but mainly North African) over at the OMSA site: http://www.omsa.org/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=679

"Faked"? Hard word to define. They are, as I think I said, readily available ready-made with military tailors all over Bangkok. You walk in and buy a ribbon bar that matches your entitlement, or one you'd like to have in your collection, or one you'd like to flog on eBay. Maybe the question to ask is whether anyone has ever worn these ribbon bars? Short of a DNA test, I'd suggest "no".

I'd go beyond this: Normally, researchers do their own work. Most archives do not have people on staff to do people's work for them. Research, after all is a lot of work . . . and a lot of fun. Those who have these skills sell them for more than the cost of a postage stamp. Those who collect British or Soviet awards know this.

Congratulations, nice low number. Now we need to find some with documentation!

Have been checking, paid about what Bob did.

Sub-Saharan Africa is really, really hard. There is little enough on Arab Africa, but much less on other areas (except for purely "colonial" awards and for South Africa). We may not want to get into a debate on why there is such little information on Africa, but some of the reasons seem obvious. The best information out there is on Megan Robertson's fine site, which has done a great job getting us started on Africa: http://www.medals.org.uk/ We do need better, however. I have put up some North African awards (anyone who is an Arab League member) over at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=2785

As I recall -- and you must remember it was an emotional moment! -- not much more than Marshall's Suvorov (which I have also had the chance to "feel-up"). While I can't use the word "disappointed" regarding a Victory, . . . .

I fear that these (and other) Indian rolls, if they survived the "good-bye" archival bonfires of the British in 1947, were probably thrown out in a major office cleaning of the Ministry of Defence Medal Offcice in the late-1970s/early-1980s. I keep trying and hoping for a certain answer.

Yes, it is addressed here at http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=4894 The forum's "search" function can be very useful.

And if you ask nicely, they may let you fondle it. I had that orgasmic opportunity once, though being on the history faculty at Kansas State University (with offices in Eisenhower Hall) probably helped.