peter monahan

Sounds like an interesting group, John. Would you care to share it with the group? Ideally, a photo and description of how you came by it. I'm afraid I have no sources to suggest - the printed ribbons I'm familiar with are Russian or, in a very few cases, form the Middle East. Perhaps a good printer could suggest a solution to your dilemna. The other possibility, and it is just that, is the Orders and medals Society of America. I was a member decades ago and believe that, then at least, they had a 'ribbon bank' to which members deposited hard to find medal ribbons. Perhaps that still exists and might have what you need or be able to steer you to sources. Megan, our medal maven, may also have suggestions. I haven't seen you post before, so if you are a new member, welcome to our group! Peter

Thank you, John. Good to know that someone is going the extra mile to make the right stuff! I occasionally patronize Wydean Weaving, who have been making regimental lace and such for more than a century and its always good to know that not everything has been driven out of the market by the 'almost as good' offshore stuff. For some things there is no substitute!

Thanks, but yours works fine.

I don't think the right facing thing is just you, mate. I've read something about left and right as it applies to action on stages and movie screens and why the 'good guys' or stronger characters come on from one side and not the other, but b*****ed if I can remember any details at the end of a long day. But its one o' them psycho-mo-logical thingies, based on how the brain processes information, I think. Maybe it will come to me in a dream and I can post it tomorrow. Or not.

Yes, I expect that would quite ruin one's day, were one to be on the receiving end!

Late to the fair here, but one of the things which shows up very commonly in regimental and other histories of WWI Canadians are photos of the various 'troopers' which took the boys over and brought them home. A half dozen names come to mind at once, so I suspect the total is several dozen, most of which survived the war and whose photos are probably easy enough to find, but I wonder how hard it would be to find a post card for each. I actually snaffled an egg cup out of a junk pile which was silver plated and named to a royal Mail ship which did troop carrying in WWII and if one were interested I suspect such souvenirs are not uncommon and probably not at all expensive, though of course the squaddies would not have had access to such swank kit during their voyages!

Nice idea! Along the lines of 'honourable enemies', perhaps?

Thank you, Aubagne, for providing that answer.

"It lacks representation of his British Imperial Order ribbons as well as his other Indian Princely State, Iraqi, Lebanese, Egyptian, Italian, and additional foreign decoration ribbons." Clearly the Nawab needed a larger chest!

Shouldn't like to be capture carrying one, though. I imagine the German view of the 'fun' was rather different!

Dan You will need to be more specific in your request. In the Napoleonic period there were a number of drill manuals for both line and light infantry, and in 1807 one was finally adopted as the 'official' version. However, especially among volunteer units, others continued to be used and in some regiments there were undoubtedly local interpretations of some movements. For Lights, there was A practical guide for the light infantry officer by Thomas Henry Cooper, published in 1806. I'm not certain when and if the 'Shorncliffe method' was superceded by a later model, as lights tended to fade away as distinct bodies, thought retaining the title, when the rifle became standard issue in the mid 19th century. Here is a link to Cooper's book, however, for the Napoleonic period light drill: http://books.google.ca/books?id=AgcHAAAAQAAJ&printsec=titlepage&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false Peter

Would it be cynical to suggest that BOTH reasons may have been involved. "There may be a problem with safety with the new spikes sir. Men and horses may be in danger." "Lovely!, that means we can advance a sensible practical reason for wanting a regimental distinction and not just sound like whiners, like the Guards, who have to be different, 'just because'." I mean, I know horses aren't very bright, but surely they are clever enough not to impale their eyeballs on sticks, bamboo shoots or metal spikes? Ditto gunners, I hope.

Nice one!

Very nice, Stuka Kris! Not to worry about the politicl correctness either. As Mervyn says, different times, different mores. I've always been fascibnated by old maps myself, probably dating from my childhood when I flipped through an atlas my father bouhgt, probably before my birth in 1955. Even as a teen, I was fascinated by how many bits of the Pacific were under the 'guardianship' of the British, French or Americans and now, 6 decades later, how many bits of the maps are just wrong! I can easily imagine a class of students looking at the 'old globe' and imagining what in English was called the 'dark continent', with all that implied both positive and negative. Perhaps some of them went on to see parts of that world too. I will always remember my first visit to St. Paul's Cathedral in London and a wall plaque there which commemorates 4 brothers. Three died in the Colonial Service in west Africa and one on campaign in India. The oldest was less than 30 at his death and I suspect none of them left much money behind or other 'spoils of empire' but rather what Kipling called 'the white man's burden' - the notion which seems so odd and arrogant today that they had a moral duty to improve the world! Long ramble there, but thanks for posting the globe pictures! Peter

Quick work and well done, Megan!

That is indeed an impressive 'chest'. I suspect some of our 'foreign medals' experts can make more of it than but from the ribbons ahead of the British cluster and the Pakistani ones after, a head of state from one of the princely states which went to Pakistan on Partition. Only 188 years old, you say? My nation - Canada - will be 150 years old next year! And our oldest buildings here - there are a few in Quebec City - are less than 400 years old. Nothing to some of the shrines and fortresses in your part of the world. Peter

Even if it does read 'CDS', errors in naming are not unknown. A nice find if it is to the Guards.

Yes, welcome aboard, Tariq. One of my life long interests is the old British Indian Army and its successor units and its nice to have someone with expertise - i consider myself only a dabbler - in this often obscure branch of military history and collecting. Peter

Indeed an interesting piece. The lion looks heraldic, which doesn't men NOT military but I feel a touch fancy in style to be a badge. However, I am by no means an expert on early British plates and badges and must admit that 'R V P' conveys nothing to me either. However, I'm sure some of the UK members can assist. Welcome to the GMIC, by the way. Always nice to get fresh blood and new perspecyives. Peter

I, from the depths of my ignorance - 40 years of largely sitting on the sidelines watching, as opposed to buying, selling and owning - was agreeing with Jock's assessment of the object. Don't disagree that it is worthy of research but as a 'gut feeling', it still smells. I hadn't payed a huge amount of attention to the remarks anent a 'quick flip' except to agree to myself that it leaves a bit of a sour taste. However, I wasn't offended by the remarks and have to agree with Mervyn, on calm second thought, that one man's quick flip is another man's investment in the hobby. Its certainly how I've paid for things in the past. On the topic of 'dealers', however one defines that term, I can only quote my father, a professor of philosophy: 'knowledge is neither good nor bad' and, by extension, sharing knowledge generally does not carry any moral burden. We are here because we like to see, discuss and research militaria. If someone uses the collective 'wisdom' of the group to sell something, rightly or wrongly identified, we are not morally culpable in either case. It's about intent, IMHO, and I don't intend to enrich or impoverish anyone by my historical maunderings. No harm, no foul, gentlemen?

Skimming rather than reading, I missed the 168 hours FP! That is harsh indeed. He must have been a very bad boy indeed but presumably one whom the CO decided could be salvaged for the regiment as opposed to being consigned to the glass house or shot. It would be interesting to see the details of the court martial. Here in Canada those records are available, though not on-line yet. Are they similarly accessible for British soldiers?

Not surprisingly, one doesn't often hear or read about the missions the SAS of various armies carry out under cover and or in civilian clothes and identities. Sussing out enemy artillery positions in Serbia/Bosnia comes to mind, as does the infamous Gibraltar IRA 'take down' several decades ago now. Not just residual paranoia on the part of the military.

Still makes joining a Sikh regiment a bit odd. Like the old joke: "McKey, present. O'Rourke, present. Jones, present. Feinstein, present. Brown, present. Schmidt, present. Liverpool Scottish, present and correct, sir!" Gotta be a good story there, whoever or whatever he turns out to be.

And if you want the lyrics of songs actually sung on the march in WWII, find a copy of "Songs from the Front and Rear" which was, at least when published in the 1970's, the definitive list of dirty army songs!

Lovely thing! H***ish hard to store and display any number of them however. Unless you turn them into coffee tables. [Joking!]