Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 I have a knights cross with swords for the Hohenzollern House Order.It is stamped on the bottom of the 6 o'clock arm:S & W .. then there is a quarter moon followed by a crown and 937.Can someone decipher this for me and hopefully tell me the vintage?Is there any chance this may be an issued item?Thanks,Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deruelle Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 Hi, S & W for Sy and Wagner, the juweler937 is for silver hallmarkCrown for Imperial hallmark.Can you show them pleaseRegardsChristophe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley1965 Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 Hi, S & W for Sy and Wagner, the juweler937 is for silver hallmarkCrown for Imperial hallmark.Can you show them pleaseRegardsChristopheYes, PLEASE post pics of the HHO and hallmarks. Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Author Share Posted November 26, 2006 I am trying to get pics. I am not very good at it.There is also a quarter moon.Based on this limited description can you hazard a guess to vintage?It has a gold (gilt) finish.Thanks,Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Author Share Posted November 26, 2006 Well this is the best I can do.I can't get close enough to show the markings.obverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Author Share Posted November 26, 2006 reverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 1916-18. Before that these were GOLD.This is the classic "penultimate" Prussian officers' award of WW1, and a very close approximation of a WW2 German Cross in Gold as far as what they were generally given out for to most recipients en route to a Pour le Merite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Author Share Posted November 26, 2006 Hi RickI am confused.. Are you saying this is a vintage 1914-1918 or a WW2 item?I sort of thought the quarter moon and crown marking would establish it as WW1.Thanks Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Cole Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 This is my favorite Prussian decoration. I had one once that had markings that loked like this. Is this what yours has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 26, 2006 Author Share Posted November 26, 2006 Daniel,Looks the same to me but it is rather hard to fully make out your pic. I think my markings are a bit better formed, but it is hard to say.Thanks,Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Dwyer Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 Hi RickI am confused.. Are you saying this is a vintage 1914-1918 or a WW2 item?I sort of thought the quarter moon and crown marking would establish it as WW1.Thanks RodWhen Rick said, "This is the classic "penultimate" Prussian officers' award of WW2...." I think it was a typo. I'm pretty sure he meant to say WW1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Yasssss. That's true. I slipped my mittens onto the adjoining key there as my train of thought making a comparison with the next war derailed me. But I did start it with dating the silver gilt type "1916-18." I fixed it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VtwinVince Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Very nice award, but I think the silver content should read 938. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 27, 2006 Author Share Posted November 27, 2006 Very nice award, but I think the silver content should read 938.Daniel's posting above shows 937 and mine does too.Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medalnet Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Daniel's posting above shows 937 and mine does too.RodActually, this does exist. 937/1000 parts of silver equals exactly 15 Loth. Loth was the old unit to measure precious metal content. Read more here: Silver content marks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe campbell Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 andreas!lovely site.thanks for the reference!joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 27, 2006 Author Share Posted November 27, 2006 whewwww .... thank you medal.netI was getting a little nervous!!!So maybe when the switch was made from gold to silver gilt there was still some older 15 lothsilver in stock that was used before they went to 938.In any event I am breathing easier. Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VtwinVince Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Hmmm, thanks for that information. You learn something new on this site every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 28, 2006 Author Share Posted November 28, 2006 (edited) I hope I am not irritating anyone by beating a dead horse, but I just have to add this:Given that 16 Loth was 100% silver, 15 Loth would be .9375 (15/16). To round upwards to .938 would not quite be correct in terms of absolutely valuing the metal. The more conservative method would be to use .937 if it had by law to be expressed in thousands. Later the smelters evidently decided to very slightly upgrade to .938 when the 15 Loth stocks were depleted. They could have downgraded to .937. Oh well .... who knows what really happened.Sorry guys but I do tent to be overly intent with details.I feel better now!!! Rod Edited November 28, 2006 by Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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