Mike Huxley Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 This lovely little pair just happened to drop onto my door mat this morning. I believe only about 1087 awards with the 1914 bar were awarded of the Saxe-Altenburg silver Duke Ernst medal. Combining this with the Mecklenburg "Friedrich Franz-Kreuz" has even narrowed the number who would have been awarded this pair.Can anybody put a name to these??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev in Deva Posted May 15, 2007 Share Posted May 15, 2007 Hallo Mike, what a beautiful and colourful pair Kevin in Deva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stogieman Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Kind of scary how much of this stuff has passed through my hands at one time or another...... I can trace the geneology of owners for the last 2 years!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 The Altenburg roll for that was published by the late Erhard Roth...but this will take the Mecklenburg roll to compare with.I don't know if "seeheldd" has the roll for it with his other Mecklenburg awards. Lord knows, there can't be TWO of them with THIS odd a pair!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 Super! Absolutely super!! Congratulations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 I must admit that I haven't seen any bar like this one,very colourfull and full of unknown medals to me!Congratulations!Kind regards,Jacky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 For many many years the "noncombatant" and "war effort" awards were not highly regarded by Imperial collectors.In my own case, I sold almost all of mine when I got into Soviet collecting 13 years ago. @#&%*!!!! NOW, as rolls come out, and we get some idea of the real numbers awarded, no matter how "non exciting" these may SEEM compared to frontline bravery awards, the smaller the state, the much rarer these are.That Altenburg medal with the wrap-around 1914 bar, for instance, was awarded only 1,091 times (1,086 as this combination, and 5 bars to a pre-war medal)Rare as 1,091 is, SUBTRACT 381 awards to women and 1 lone one to an Austrian and already the Possible Suspects List is immediately knocked down to709 German men.A good number of those can be eliminated as military or ex-military personnel and people with other known awards, but I have never pursued it beyond this point because many hundreds of people about whom nothing will ever show up in awards records would be left. What once was thought impossible is now eventually... inevitable. The key will be a Mecklenburg roll for the second cross which can be compared to the Altenburg one. On that happy day, I expect the name will LEAP off the page.And based on what "seeheld" has shown us of the Mecklenburg rolls that DO exist... like Lippe-Detmold's rolls, there will be birth and other data included to add some LIFE back to the name.The 20XXs/201Xs are going to be very very exciting years for Imperial research, with the team assembled HERE pursuing our inter-related goals of award rolls transcriptions and officer research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share Posted May 16, 2007 Thank you gents. I had the feeling that this little gem MUST at some time have passed through your hands Stogie Rick, when I first saw the bar I didn't realise how relatively few awards in this combination had been awarded, but after a little searching it started to dawn on me Now when did you say those Mecklenburg rolls are going to be available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stogieman Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Bumped. This is a piece that should be committed to memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerd Becker Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Absolutely!!! Very nice pair, Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted June 26, 2007 Author Share Posted June 26, 2007 Bumped. This is a piece that should be committed to memory.Thanks Gerd and Stogie,I would just love to know who this bar was owned by. It's got to be the rarest in my collection. Unfortunatly I just don't have the skills and knowledge of our Rick to be able to do any more .... I'm in HIS hands on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeheld Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 Hi friends,just now I'm back from Singapore. Yes I have the FFK roll complete. 869 men's and 246 women received this decoration. I think it's very simple to find out the name. But I don't have this Altenburg list from Mr. Roth. According to this medalbar it's shut be a non Mecklenburg-Schwerin Citizen. I will check my list, because almost all awarded person's are Citizens from Mecklenburg-Schwerin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 Hi friends,just now I'm back from Singapore. Yes I have the FFK roll complete. 869 men's and 246 women received this decoration. I think it's very simple to find out the name. But I don't have this Altenburg list from Mr. Roth. According to this medalbar it's shut be a non Mecklenburg-Schwerin Citizen. I will check my list, because almost all awarded person's are Citizens from Mecklenburg-Schwerin.Thanks seeheld ..... It would be fantastic if you were able to come up with a name.Cheers, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rick Research Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 I've got Roth's list. There are a number of odd recipients at things like the Soldiers Theater in Lille, or hotel owners in Berlin, or medical personnel at war hospitals, but nobody on the Altenburg list who can be identified as a Mecklenburger, either.So this person is a "foreigner" for BOTH awards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nesredep Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 HiNice pair. Nesredep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeheld Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 (edited) After a quick check I found out, one possibility:Reinhold, Friedrich Mei?en, Kaufmann 31.07.1918Later I will do a properly check.Best regardsSeeheld Edited September 17, 2007 by seeheld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 After a quick check I found out, one possibility:Reinhold, Friedrich Mei?en, Kaufmann 31.07.1918Later I will do a proberly check.Best regardsSeeheldOhhhhhhhh my!!!! what other forum has this depth of research ability amongst it's membership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulsterman Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 After a quick check I found out, one possibility:Reinhold, Friedrich Mei?en, Kaufmann 31.07.1918Later I will do a properly check.Best regardsSeeheldIs that the painter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Powell Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 beautiful bar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 Oh by the way, it was very remiss of me not to post a scan of the reverse of this bar. So here it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Huxley Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 And a closer scan of the Obverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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