Luftwaffe Opinions on "M43" and white visor

[juvatwad]

I'd like your opinions on these two hats, please. First, billed as an M43:

Thanks,

Ian

[juvatwad]

Second, a white visor:

[Paul R]

Hi,

I am not a hat specialist at all, but from what I can see, they both look like they could be OK to me. That M43 is very odd though. I would definitely want a second or third opinion on them both.

[Bob Lyons]

Hi Ian

I was asked to take a peek at this thread too, and having had a look at your two caps, I would suggest taking them back

to where they came from for a refund asap, the M43 cap isn't an issue cap, and the only thing I could suggest is that it may

be perhaps something made in the field or in another country, problem is that you have to convince other collectors of that too,

and I think you would struggle, interior is not like anything I would like to see in a real officer M43 cap, the piping is poorly applied,

and the whole shape if it is wrong, the insignia does look ok though...(I wouldn't be happy with that cap at all).

Your 2nd cap, the whole thing to me looks bad, (apart from wreath and cockade) I would suggest losing both of these caps

to wherever you got them from. Eagle looks cast to me, cap top is definitely not of the period, and the lower portion is not

what I would want to see either, sorry to be on the negative side, but nicer examples of both exist and are obtainable, but

officer M43 caps for the Luftwaffe are getting very hard to find now, and a good example of a white top is starting to become

a challenge too, but can still be tracked down with the better dealers.

Sorry for the negativity, but these 2 caps don't thrill me at all, sorry mate!

Bob

[Paul R]

Thanks Bob!

I will definitely consult you before I buy any headgear!

Paul

[Bob Lyons]

Hi Paul,

I would suggest Francois, Jos or Gene way before you get to me! (but thanks mate ).

Hope your work load is allowing a bit of collecting as well!

Best wishes

Bob

[Jos Le Conté]

The M43 is probably a postwar Bundeswehr cap plus the silver piping might be added one day.., nevertheless not a era cap IMO.

I remember I've seen many postwar gabardine NCO caps like this 30 years ago, could be bought by the dozen..

Looks like one of those with added insignia..

I don't like the white cap top either..., both would be not for my collection.

Jos.

Edited October 27, 2007 by Jos Le Cont

[juvatwad]

The M43 is probably a postwar Bundeswehr cap plus the silver piping might be added one day.., nevertheless not a era cap IMO.

I remember I've seen many postwar gabardine NCO caps like this 30 years ago, could be bought by the dozen..

Looks like one of those with added insignia..

I don't like the white cap top either..., both would be not for my collection.

Jos.

This is the kind of help I need and appreciate. After comparing the M43 with photos, I agree. Before I accepted the white visor, a couple of knowledgable collectors here in the US looked it over and called it good. Could you point out specifically what is wrong with the white visor? How should the top look? What should I look for on a correct period eagle?

Thanks,

Ian

Edited October 27, 2007 by juvatwad

[Jos Le Conté]

Hello Ian,

The white top doesn't feel right to me because the cloth is rather thin with hardly any structure..

It's a bit T-shirt like material, while the white tops I've seen show a more stiff waffled or striped material.

Although it seems to fit I've a feeling the top doesn't belong to the cap.., might be added later.

The cap itself looks like a later war example with inferior leather sweatband, might be OK.

Here's a shot of how I like to see white tops..

Jos.

Edited October 27, 2007 by Jos Le Cont

[Gene]

The M43 is postwar with original insignia applied, and I do not care for the white top visor at all.

[juvatwad]

Yes it appears that the "white" part of the visor is not original. The band, visor, and cockade look OK to me, though. Here is a picture of the eagle removed. Is this bad as well?

Ian

[Jos Le Conté]

Eagle looks Ok, but it seems re-painted or something..., better to see something like this in daylight instead of in the light of a flash..

Jos.

[juvatwad]

Ok.

[nesredep]

Hello!

The eagel looks to me re-painted.

Regards

Nesredep

[Jos Le Conté]

Can you tell us of what material the eagle is made ?

Material looks a bit strange.

It's a very solid one, must be zink then..

If so, it might has a chance, I've seen some late war painted ones..

Jos.

Edited October 28, 2007 by Jos Le Cont

[juvatwad]

It's too heavy to be aluminum, and there is gold toning in the recesses on the back, especially along the groove of the upper part of the wing. Maybe brass?

Ian

[Jos Le Conté]

Brass wouldn't make sense, if it's a solid brass eagle it's fake..and heavy..

Besides that brass can be soldered and don't needs crimped in prongs like this.

You'll only find a layer of brass under silver plated eagles , which are usually struck and thin.

Solid stuff is usually zink or potmetal as they like to call it, which is grey and most of the time has a thin layer of wash/paint..

If the eagle is really made of brass I say fake.

Jos.

Edited October 28, 2007 by Jos Le Cont

[juvatwad]

I don't know then. The back is a little rough in texture similar to a late war zinc badge, which I wouldn't expect from brass, I guess. Just now if I scrape at the gold portion with a clip it turns more of a shiny silver. Maybe it is zinc. Hmmm.

[Bill Bourque]

Hello, I agree, that is a nice bullion eagle. The rest is doubtful. I like to see two parallel stich lines above the buttons. The White hat looks too weak to me. Best, Bill

[GdC26]

I?m with Jos and Gene on this one: neither cap looks good to me.

Sorry for that,

Regards,

Sandro