Ferg1 Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Is anyone here bidding on the cased Bavarian observer grouping finishing today on Ebay? Wow it is sure making much much more than it is worth (IMO) It is nearly up to ?2500 when I last looked. Items in box seem to be fine but I am just not convinced that the box is anything to do with the awards.Seems like a ' marriage ' to me . It's very easy to ' convert ' a knife and fork box or such to look like a fancy presentation box,too easy in my mind. No ribbons seem to be present with the medals and they are just (it appears) sitting in the folds of the satin box lining. Still the punters are going mental to own it,if you ask me it smells unsafe . I would put the total value of goods at ?1200 tops. Hey,ho... it's not my money !! Ferg1.
Guest Rick Research Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I've never understood why a jeweller's box is worth more than whatever's in it, me. Must be some kind of "fetish" thing beyond my limited imagination. :rolleyes:
Claudius Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 ah..ah...ah...there is more to this than meets the eye. There are photos and documents included, but (according to the seller if he is to be believed) he accidentally attached to another F-P medal bar group. And WOW, is that a great group itself. more on that below.But to begin, the observer and the F-P group are father and son. As I said, the observer has documents and photos, specifically a doc for his observer badge along with some other ancillary docs. The photo has the recipient in front of his plane (that has personalized insignia).The F-P group has a medal bar w/ 1870s EKII with oak leaves and 1914 bar. Now, I know you (like me) would be suspicious of this bar but the group comes with award docs AND a photo of the father wearing the EXACT medal bar. outstanding. still five days left in the bidding.
Stogieman Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 And that boys & girls.... is why we (A) rarely discuss active auctions, (B) ALWAYS click "View seller's other items" and © shop directly on the site.... because ...."This item is not available for purchase on eBay United States. Learn more about our accepted payments policy. View the original listing on eBay and buy this item on eBay Germany "
Stogieman Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Oh yeah... I can't see the actual document in the pile.... but that may very well be the only documented 1914 EK2 Repeat bar to the 1870 EK2 we will see for a very, very, very long time....
VtwinVince Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I've been following this auction, and I thought at first the spange with repeat bar was put together. Then I looked a little closer.....
PKeating Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 Link?Reference number? Tried several searches and came up with nothing.PK
Claudius Posted March 19, 2009 Posted March 19, 2009 I've been following this auction, and I thought at first the spange with repeat bar was put together. Then I looked a little closer.....Your response is bit cryptic. Do you believe it or do you have some doubts?
Stogieman Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 The photo has the exact bar... including the repeat bar!yep, uh, uh, uh....Can you say AMEN my Brothers and Sisters?
gregM Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 It would really be nice if this were to go to someone we know. I would love tosee good closeup scans of that bar.Could this be the missing link? :rolleyes:
Les Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 (edited) The boxed aviation related materials went for ?5100 and the bar with the repeat clasp is almost half that price with a few more days to go. If the person who got the aviation items wants the documents (and bar belonged to the father) he's going to have to pay a hefty amount to keep it all together at this point. He also stands a good chance of not being able to keep both of them together. Pity to see groups split up, but this looks like what's about to happen.Stogie: Non culpa mea est.Les Edited March 20, 2009 by Les
PKeating Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 (edited) Shame to see it split up. The father's medal bar certainly seems to be the one in the photograph, which would make it the only documented example of the 1914 Bar to the 1870 EK2 I recall seeing. Assuming the Bar itself is original. It probably is. But if not, it wouldn't be the first time valuable accessories had been removed from groupings and replaced by fakes. If the medal bar has been assembled more recently, it has been very well done by someone who took the time to reproduce the angles at which accessories were fixed and their positions relative to the ribands. It strikes me that the vendor doesn't know what he is selling or, at least, didn't know when he put this family grouping up for sale. Look at the careless manner in which the father's medals have been shoved in the case. I would say that it is OK and might go for it myself if I hadn't sunk this quarter's 'recreational' budget into my latest old motorbike. PK Edited March 20, 2009 by PKeating
jaba1914 Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 The cased aviation group was sold with all award documents and many more. So that the reason why the price rise so high.Regards Alex
VtwinVince Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 Looks like the spange and docs group has been pulled. Hopefully the buyer of the aviation group managed to keep all together.
jaba1914 Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 All that belong together was sold together. the buyer of the aviation group got all the documents from the observer and the documents from the father with the big 1870 bar will be sell together. Nothing suspect here except the confusind description.Regards Alex
Claudius Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 The boxed aviation related materials went for ?5100 ...and that's why Claudius (as a flieger group collector) didn't get this group.
VtwinVince Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 That's pretty big money for this material, and why I as well didn't get it, especially since I am still in the hole for getting a Jasta Boelcke Fliegerjacke recently.
Stogieman Posted March 21, 2009 Posted March 21, 2009 Les, I know, I know....I think as time progresses, as the market continually gets flooded with fakes, newly made bars, etc. When a group shows up that is just... well, perfect.Prices will sail to the moon.New blood, lots of money.... and the rest of us will bemoan the "Good old days"At this point, I'll just concentrate on trying to retrieve pieces I sold. At least bring back home the ones I know to be good. Docs, groups, etc. to a flyer.... documented 1870 repeat spange.... this is like the Holy Grail for an EK collector! I expect this group to end up over 10K for all of it. Frankly, the 1870 bar and pix is the real prize IMO.
Claudius Posted March 21, 2009 Posted March 21, 2009 Looks like the spange and docs group has been pulled. Hopefully the buyer of the aviation group managed to keep all together.What happened? Is he correcting the posting and then resubmit?
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