Almost an Iron Cross

[Tom Y]

In February1864 Wilhelm I decided a award was needed for the war with Denmark, but didn't want to resurrect the Iron Cross. Thus the Milit?r=Ehrenzeichen was created. It came in a 1st Class cross and a 2nd Class medal, to be awarded to the rank of Feldwebel and below for "merit before the enemy". To put it in perspective, it was worn on the Iron Cross ribbon. It went on to be awarded for the "notch wars"of 1866 and the colonial wars. In the Great War it was awarded to foreigners in lieu of an Iron Cross.

[Tom Y]

It came in a rather nice silk lined case.

[Tom Y]

That was hinged on the wrong side

Spangenst?ckes were made in silver and silvered bronze with the much more practical ?se and ring.

[VtwinVince]

Great examples, Tom, especially the one on the spange. I've always thought this an underappreciated award.

[Tom Y]

There were some minor variations over the years.

[Tom Y]

No, this is not a mini.

In 1872 a smaller version was instituted for non Prussians, such as native troops, and, inexplicably, designated a Krieger=Verdeinst=Medaille.

[VtwinVince]

I have a couple of the small silver ones, apparently they are scarce. I'd sure like to find one on a spange.

[saschaw]

Nice thread, nice medals and a really nice medal bar, thanks for showing.

In the Great War it was awarded to foreigners in lieu of an Iron Cross.

I really appreciate your knowledge but have never seen any proof for that. Do you have or know any? Please don't mix up the Prussian MEZ2, the Prussian Kriegerverdienstmedaille and the (German) Kriegerverdienstmedaille that was instituted in four classes for Black soldiers in the colonies. Those are three totally different awards.

However two look absoluetly the same... :rolleyes:

[Tom Y]

Nice thread, nice medals and a really nice medal bar, thanks for showing.

I really appreciate your knowledge but have never seen any proof for that. Do you have or know any? Please don't mix up the Prussian MEZ2, the Prussian Kriegerverdienstmedaille and the (German) Kriegerverdienstmedaille that was instituted in four classes for Black soldiers in the colonies. Those are three totally different awards.

However two look absoluetly the same...

I've never seen any hard evidence either. I'm, just going by what von Hessenthal says (if I've translated correctly).

[Guest Rick Research]

7,298 MEZ2s awarded 1866-68 for 1866 from the late Eric Ludvigsen's statistical work on Prussian awards.

Imagine my delight this week on discovering this week (I am ETERNALLY obliged to our mutual friends and Cathy Ludvigsen ) to discover the original unpublished statistical work Eric did on awards from Anhalt to W?rttemberg! :jumping:

[Eric Stahlhut]

nice thread, tom

here's another variation; it has a flat-wire ring

[Eric Stahlhut]

[Eric Stahlhut]

possible hallmark shortly past 9 o'clock mark . this is not a ding

Edited April 12, 2009 by Eric Stahlhut

[Eric Stahlhut]

this is what i got after a few minutes with a q-tip and water. based on the deepness/sharpness of the indentation, i'm inclined to think that is indeed a proofmark.

?

[Obergefreiter]

It's a nice looking medal. Does anyone have a picture of the 1st. Class cross?

[Wild Card]

No, this is not a mini.

In 1872 a smaller version was instituted for non Prussians, such as native troops, and, inexplicably, designated a Krieger=Verdeinst=Medaille.

Actually the Krieger-Verdienstmedaille was founded in 1835. There are two distinct strikings of the original design.

The first has the ?se as a part, and in the plane of, the medal. Shown below is an example of the second striking.

[Wild Card]

The second version (with the crowned ?W? monogram) replaced this version in 1873 and was awarded through 1918.

Yes, this ribbon is correct in that the first version was awarded on both the ?Red Eagle? and ?Iron Cross? ribbons.

[saschaw]

7,298 MEZ2s awarded 1866-68 for 1866 from the late Eric Ludvigsen's statistical work on Prussian awards.

Imagine my delight this week on discovering this week (I am ETERNALLY obliged to our mutual friends and Cathy Ludvigsen ) to discover the original unpublished statistical work Eric did on awards from Anhalt to W?rttemberg!

Wow. Congratulation. To all collectors out there. Could you please give the numbers for 1864, too? Just to compare. I think those were less, weren't they?

Tom, is that written at the MEZ or at the KVMs? Will take a look later.

Eric, very nice medal. I don't know the mark but I think your medal is an early one, from 1864/66 period.

[pinpon590]

I've never seen any hard evidence either. I'm, just going by what von Hessenthal says (if I've translated correctly).

To resume : 3 medals with a very similar look,but small differences :

1/ [Preussen] Milit?r-Ehrenzeichen 2. Klasse :

- Silver or bronze silvered

- Diam : 40mm

- "Kriegs-Verdienst" on back

2/ [Preussen] Krieger-Verdient-Medaille

- Silver, bronze silvered or white metal

- Diam : 25mm

- "Krieger-Verdienst" on back

3/ [Deutsche] Krieger-Verdient-Medaille, 2. Klasse in Silber

- Silver

- Diam : 25mm

- "Kriegs-Verdienst" on back

I hope I have help you !

:cheers:

Edited April 13, 2009 by pinpon590

[Guest Rick Research]

Sascha--

2,111 1864 and 1865 on the combatant ribbon and 1 on the "white black" ribbon.

[saschaw]

Thanks Rick. I think I've not yet shown my favorite Feldwebel portrait here. Being one of those 2,111 he has a double 1864 with MEZ2 and Austrian Bravery Medal, didn't participate in 1866 to be back in 1870/71 - and stayed in the military for decades. "Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen", "Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen in Gold" (gold medal that predates the "Kreuz des...") and "Kreuz der Inhaber des HOH" followed...

I'm missing some references for stuff like that, but - is there a chance to identify him? The combination has to be unique, I guess.

[Guest Rick Research]

Oh HIM? The ONLY NCO to receive the Prussian Crown Order 4th Class before the World War?

MINE is autographed and dated on his 68th birthday!

mine is bigger than yours

and just not to tease people:

[saschaw]

:speechless1:

And I looked thru whole the DOA 1904, but only checked the guys with AEZ in Gold...

Thank you! One question: does the KO4 (has to have a "50", right?) really outrank the HOH4? I actually doubt it, but am not sure about the 4th classes of HOH...

[Guest Rick Research]

Yes, the little button had to be "50." Crown ORDER 4th Class outranked Hohenzollern INHABERKREUZ.

He must have exchanged his Gold Medal for the Cross at some point.

Notice that Caville's new awards have been slid into the other awards, lifted intact together out of YOUR medal bar onto MINE-- the ribbon drapes are EXACTLY the same and have not been redone. That shows especially well at the overlap of ribbons between the 1864 War Medal and 1897 Centenary Medal.

[saschaw]

:beer: