Hungary Documents

[Gordon Craig]

Greg,

These documents were presented to the wife of Mánik János. The "ne" is added to the husbands name to indicate it is his wife.

Regards,

Gordon

[Greg Collins]

Gordon,

Thanks for the information and peek into cultural differences. Just curious... how would this lady have been addressed in everyday social settings, say while shopping or at the grocer? At least formally, it appears, she "gave up" her own identity and became known strictly by her husband's. Is this still done?

[hunyadi]

Generally my experience was that in an informal setting (IE talking to the grocer) she would have been known by her original first name. There were also many pet names or nicknames thrown into the mix. The "wife of" title was simply a very formal and traditional way of adressing her - this tradition held over from the middle ages - my clan is Robertson from - "Son of Robert"... anyhow - to adress her as "mam" or "miss" during the HUPR she would have been formally adressed as "elvtarsno" (Miss / Mrs Comrade)

Just aside - wanna tripple your money on the blank document??? :cheeky:

Edited September 28, 2010 by hunyadi

[Greg Collins]

Charles,

Thanks for the explanation; good information to have when attempting to decipher these gems. And thanks for your kind offer , but my unreasonable fetish for the Rakosi seal just won't let me part with it (I really need help ).

Edited September 28, 2010 by Greg Collins

[Gordon Craig]

Greg,

To answer your question about "is this still done" the answer is yes. One very obvious use of this form of address is on tomb stones in cemeteries. If you visit a cemetery in Budapest you will find that they have family plots and those who have been buried recently still use this naming convention.

Regards,

Gordon

[Greg Collins]

A few documents from the Rakosi era that I recently received... the first is a soldier's book belonging to Pal Wagner and begun in 1953. I'm showing the cover and the first inside pages; the remaining pages are nearly all written on and many are stamped. If you want to see any of these pages, just ask.

[Greg Collins]

Inside cover and page 1...

Edited November 4, 2010 by Greg Collins

[Greg Collins]

Next, the engineering grade book of Piroska Tokes begun in 1952. I'm showing the cover, inside cover and page 3. As with the military book, the remaining pages are full of information.

Edited November 4, 2010 by Greg Collins

[Greg Collins]

Just inside the cover... the other end of the unsightly rivet. She was, in my opinion, quite a "looker"; her grades were good, as well.

[Greg Collins]

Page 3- the initial information page...

Edited November 4, 2010 by Greg Collins

[Greg Collins]

The last for now is an elementary grade book for Eva Urban begun 31 January 1954... 28 days before I came into this world. No photo spot here (unfortunately), but plenty of grades and teacher's comments.

[Greg Collins]

Page 3- the initial information page.

[hunyadi]

Inside cover and page 1...

#1 - name

#2 - date of birth

#3 - place of service, date of entry

#4 - mothers name

#5 - branch of service

#6 - unit

#7 - rank

#8 - a/b Method of service

#9 - assignment

#10 - (Important!) Political Party

#11 - Schooling (final level)

#12 - a/b civilian service

#13 - work record

#14 - previous military service (when, where, w/ who) - have yet to find one that served in the German army...

#15 - short statement about your service - the one I'm looking at entered the Honved in 1942 served until April of 1945 and then (to my surprise!!) served in the Border Guard in 1945 after the war! (very unique!) this is also the section where they stamped (1960's 1970's 1980's) their complete release from military conscription or reserve duty

#16 - living place in the military

#17 - living place outside the military

#18 - examinations of proficiency etc..

#19 - certifications

#20 - special certifications

I may not have these entries completely correct to the terminology - but its really close

I like Piroska as well - she's a looker - and she studied my "old" profession as an Architect

Edited November 4, 2010 by hunyadi

[Greg Collins]

Thanks for the list, Charles! I'm going to go back over the book now to see what I can find out.

Edited November 4, 2010 by Greg Collins

[Gordon Craig]

Greg,

Nice lot of books covering the life of some individuals. I like to see these posted as most collectors ignore the stuff of everyday civilian life. Keep up the good work!

Regards,

Gordon

[Bob]

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/50937-awarded-to-a-hungarian/page__pid__466306#entry466306

Above thread contains a nice document giving permission to a Hungarian to wear a Mongolian award

[erikscollectables]

I like documents a lot too (although I collect pre 1945, especially the vitez order) I have a soft spot for early Party Documents.

Here are mine from 1945/46.

The Red booklet is interesting as it was made out to a vitez - the title still being named at that time - clearly not a communist title

The two booklet to the right are end of the 40s and 1950 respectively but rare so I kept them as well....

Regards, Erik

[erikscollectables]

This does not really qualify as an document - it is a voting paper.

Interesting because of the name on the top left - the upcoming Kadar Janos....

Regards, Erik

[erikscollectables]

The two booklet to the right are end of the 40s and 1950 respectively but rare so I kept them as well....

Forgot to mention the top right one is the Hungarian - Russian Friendship group membership card, 1950

And the one below the National Farmers association membership card from 1950

[erikscollectables]

The two booklet to the right are end of the 40s and 1950 respectively but rare so I kept them as well....

Forgot to mention the top right one is the Hungarian - Russian Friendship group membership card, 1950

And the one below the National Farmers association membership card from 1950

[Gordon Craig]

Erik,

Interesting pieces of paper. I am always interested in seeing documents from non military sources. They are often ignored although are more indicative of life in a country than the military documents.

Regards,

Gordon