Bilco Posted December 21, 2011 Posted December 21, 2011 Hi Gents, Off on another safari through Google I came across the US Militaria Forum, which has a section of the WW1 US vics. One thread caught my eye - http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19125 - in post #4 there are a couple of tables extracted from the Gleim Letters showing the various manufacturers of the Navy clasps and how to tell them apart. Apologies if gentlemen here are posters on that Forum too, but I mention it as it may be of help/interest. The whole WW1 US vic section is worth a trawl through. Bill
johnnymac Posted December 21, 2011 Posted December 21, 2011 (edited) Bill, Good Information on the US Military Forum. There is great information on all types of U.S. Collecting with very active members. http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/ Did you note that the clasp in the first photo is on in reverse, both the medal and clasp are U.S. issue but I have a feeling there was dealer or collector intervention on this medal. Jim Edited December 21, 2011 by johnnymac
Bilco Posted December 23, 2011 Posted December 23, 2011 Hi Jim - No, I hadn't noticed the reversed medal! Is it a Reissue Type, either with bevelled lug or tab suspension, or just a rather heavy bead of solder on a Type 2? Bill
Bilco Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 Hi Jim, Many thanks for clarifying the ribbon issue - I read through the postings from before the creation of our special Interest section some time ago, and obviously misunderstood what was being said. Another web site I've found on a Google safari - http://www.ww1medals.net/WW1-US-Navy-Victory-medals.htm There is also a page for the Army. This page shows a letter laying out the Navy criteria for applying for the Victory medal. In the examples shown below it I see there is a fake 'Russia' Navy clasp. Also shown is the ribbon with the figure 3 on it - is the meaning of this determined? I read somewhere that it was worn by members of the Army 3rd Division, but I'm not sure if this is correct. Happy New Year. Bill
Bilco Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 Another find on the US Militaria Forum - a vic with a bar showing a torpedo with 'TUSCANIA' on it. http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t15200.html I hadn't heard before about the sinking of the troopship Tuscania, taking US Army units across to France, so this is very interesting. I assume the bar is an unofficial addition, created by the association of the survivors of the sinking - they seem to have had several conventions after the Great War. Bill
johnnymac Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Good Morning I hope you all will enjoy my posting. These groups are different from each other and there are more which I will post at a later day. This is why it is interesting to collect US Victory medals. Regards, Jim M.
Bilco Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Hi Jim, Wow! A great reference source - many thanks for posting the images. Is this part of your collection? Bill
johnnymac Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Yes Bill this is just part of my US collection, Thanks Jim M.
lambert Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Hello to all Jim, great post!! When your book comes out? Lambert :beer:
RelicHunter Posted April 25, 2012 Posted April 25, 2012 Can anyone tell me what type this is? There is a small hallmark in the 5 o'clock position that I can't quite make out. http://greatwarcollection.weebly.com/united-states-victory-medal.html
lambert Posted April 25, 2012 Posted April 25, 2012 Hi RH Type 2. This is the most common model with a diamond-shaped bail welded to the medal. is the mark on the medal E. Fraser. (Sculptor James E. Fraser) regards Lambert
johnnymac Posted May 14, 2012 Posted May 14, 2012 I am beside myself on this bid, This medal just sold for $355.99 + S&H If you want to see this ebay item number 350563346572 a U.S. Victory Medal done in a navy style, but using an army style (not an authorized style) but fantasy style clasp. This clasp is "French made", and the person who made this reproduction miss understood the English use of the word "Grand" Fleet and put the English word "Large" Fleet on the fake clasp. This French fantasy set can be found with both the Large Fleet and the Grand Fleet clasp. Some where along the line someone pointed the Large Fleet error out. As some as I can dig out my $12 Large Fleet clasp, I will post it.
RobW Posted May 15, 2012 Posted May 15, 2012 (edited) As some as I can dig out my $12 Large Fleet clasp, I will post it. Hello Jim, That would be good to see your copy. On that theme; there is currently a lot of US Navy vic clasps on ebay that seem too new and not of the correct colour or finish. Do any of our US vic collectors have any ideas or opinions as to their background? When I have time I will post a pic of one for reference. Regards, Rob Edited May 15, 2012 by RobW
RobW Posted May 15, 2012 Posted May 15, 2012 (edited) To all, As indicated here is a pic of one of these very new US navy vic bars. Any comments welcome? Regards, Rob Edited May 15, 2012 by RobW
johnnymac Posted May 15, 2012 Posted May 15, 2012 (edited) Clasps: 1. My clasp. 2. The clasp that sold on ebay for $356 or 222 GPB. The letters and clasp style matches No.1, but not the stars. 3. As you can "all" see, the Stars on Nos 2 and 3 are without question in the same manufacturer family. Yet neither the letters or clasp style match No.2. 4. This clasp, the lettering and half moon ends all match No.3, but not the stars. 5. Note the star are the same as No.1, yet the lettering is the same as No.3, 4 and 5. And like Nos.3, 4 and 5 there is no spacers at each end. Some people think that Nos. 3, 4 and 5 were made by Bailey Banks and Biddle. I do not! Ask yourself why would BB&B make a Navy clasp (No.3) in an Army style clasp when they already had their own Navy style clasp? I also posted these: This photo just above has three clasps in it. note they all have the same style clasp, lettering and stars as my clasp of the "Large Fleet" clasp, I listed in the very top grouping.. The single clasp below the three clasp is all in the same style lettering, clasp and stars as the $356. "Large Fleet" clasp. or No.2 in the photo in the top grouping. To me this photo clearly shows that at some point there was a change in the stars and later a change to the clasp design. Without question these clasps are French made! Edited May 15, 2012 by johnnymac
johnnymac Posted May 15, 2012 Posted May 15, 2012 This Navy clasp is also showing up a lot on the market, note they look like they were painted black then wiped off to make them look old. I seen them in Aviation, Submarine, and Naval Battery style.
johnnymac Posted May 15, 2012 Posted May 15, 2012 (edited) Sorry I did not show the back with the Word "FRANCE" so I took this clasp off a piece of ribbon I keep all my odd clasps on. Regards Jim Edited May 15, 2012 by johnnymac
RobW Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 (edited) Hello Jim, Thanks for the reply. That is a nice selection of bars that you have. Do you have any others in your collection? In regards the more shiny of the two LARGE FLEET bars, (most recent ebay one) have you seen any other examples of this sort and variety; as it looks similar but not the same as the others that you have posted? Have you seen any Army varieties like this? There seems to be many different varieties of these Army and Navy bars to the US vic. It certainly makes for interesting collecting. Regards, Rob Edited May 16, 2012 by RobW
johnnymac Posted May 24, 2012 Posted May 24, 2012 This interesting clasp was handmade. It would seem that this veteran felt he was entitled to the Somme-Defensive clasp.
lambert Posted May 24, 2012 Posted May 24, 2012 (edited) Humm. very interesting. I think a little tricky to compare the clap of the American Vic .. because a large amount available in eb.y really have seen many fakes and fantasies .. lambert Edited May 24, 2012 by lambert
johnnymac Posted May 25, 2012 Posted May 25, 2012 Lambert, American clasps is the fun part, as I say "what is life without a little excitement". cheers, Jim
lambert Posted May 25, 2012 Posted May 25, 2012 (edited) Hello Jim I agree with your observation .. perhaps I ought to venture more in this category .. and by chance noticed this example the sale .. I'm tempted to buy it. see, and tell me what you think .. Lambert Edited May 25, 2012 by lambert
johnnymac Posted May 25, 2012 Posted May 25, 2012 (edited) Lambert, This is a medal possibly one that was issued to member a of the 91st Division. All the clasps are correct. To me I would wait for one in a much better condition. If you are going to collect and keep them for a long time. I see them for between $85 - $125. in very good condition. Jim, Thanks for asking. Edited May 25, 2012 by johnnymac
RobW Posted July 5, 2012 Posted July 5, 2012 This interesting clasp was handmade. It would seem that this veteran felt he was entitled to the Somme-Defensive clasp. To all, Has anyone else seen any of these inscribed like battle clasps? Regards, Rob
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