Guest Rick Research Posted May 25, 2005 Posted May 25, 2005 I've been looking for one of these--the highest professional badge for Soviet railways personnel-- for ages, and finally got this one:a late WW2 or immediate postwar issue, made with the banner at top struck as one piece with the badge (earlier ones were a second piece), the hammer and sickle still pinned on, serial numbered, and what makes this one interesting is its HUGE screw back, made by the Sh. M. Z. factory for the N.K.P.S. "NarKomat" or "Peoples Commissariat" was changed to "Ministry" on 15 March 1946 for all such "State Organs."The SECOND disk under this one is unusual-- apparently for a smoother, wrinkle free fit. The underside of the maker marked screw disk and the top of that second loosely fitting holed disk are silvered. The maker marked disk is actually steel.I suspect VERY strongly from the reverse evidence that this badge-- and all such "brass" badges-- originally were completely silvered like the earlier badges-- and that (as is almost universal on WW2 shoulder board stars), the silvered finish has simply EVAPORATED off all parts exposed to air. This has NOT been polished off, it simply vanishes, like the German WW2 zink badges with no surviving finish.
Guest Rick Research Posted May 25, 2005 Posted May 25, 2005 As with many Soviet awards, this could be bestowed more than once. Railways "Lieutenant Colonel" N. D. Yerokhin in 1948 (local Veterans Commissariat file photo as Captain of the Reserve) is wearing TWO over the right breast pocket of a white summer Kitel only distinguishable as railways and not army by his distinctive narrow shoulder boards.
Gerd Becker Posted May 26, 2005 Posted May 26, 2005 This is my favourite Soviet badge. If i would have found one with Document, i would own one now. Its a very attractive and well-desingned badge. Just looks teriffic! Gerd
Guest Rick Research Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 (edited) Now you guys know my obsession about trying to date numbered awards in the absence of documentation, based on other known serial numbers...so far I am having a very tough--indeed, surprisingly tough-- time getting some solid dates/numbers matches on what SHOULD be-- but is NOT-- a fairly common badge:1) Miniature real silver version: Highest number seen #3,015. Award #1 was bestowed on 1 October 1934.2) Full size real silver type: #6,251 was bestowed on 12 October 1941 BUT (see page 2+ of this thread)#6,552 =#8,596 was awarded 7 May 1940 3) Brass/bronze mirror reverse(mr) or indented train & banner smooth (itb/s) type (nickled finish may have evaporated away): #15,403 (mr) =#28,228 (itb/s) = 25 March 1944#30,566 = "1944"#36,684 (itb/s) =#40,477 = 2 October 1944#45,826 (itb/s) = 15 September 1943#55,089 (itb/s) = 10 June 1941 (!!??!!)#66,580 (mr) = my badge above, pre-March 1946 "NKPS" screw nut#69,317 = 1946 but can't read date from tiny book illustration, but "MPS" stamp"Peoples' Commissariat" (NK) designations were changed to "Ministry" (M) in March 1946#77,124 (mr) = 26 July 1946 #80,177 (itb/s) = 26 July 1946#80,905 (itb/s) =highest number observed #108,752(lowest number of the post-Stalin engine type #112,050 suggests change here)Now Lapin's book-- seehttp://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1786...ost&p=14239states that on average annually 2,000 to 4,500 badges were awarded BUT note the October 1941 number above. His book also says that "during the years of the Great Patriotic War 28,259" badges were awarded BUT also states that the bulk of ALL awards--- some 44,000, were bestowed from 1944 to 1946. That does not tally with the 6X,XXX numbered badges above.Any contributions to dated serial numbers, NK versus M screw nuts etc gratefully appreciated. Please note that such information added in on following pages of this thread Magically Appear above so the numbers are all together in one easy to see list. Edited July 13, 2009 by Rick Research
Chris S Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 RickI agree, very nice badges indeed, considering the size of the railways and all its associated troops I think the badge is quite hard to get hold of, the silver ones in particular.These are two of mine in silver and bronze, the silver are hallmarked and the bronze ones like many badges down graded in materials had a silver finish and like you say, worn off in time.Chris
Chris S Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 The back of the silver...they all came with the double back plate....most get lost over time....Number 6552
Chris S Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 The back of the bronze version....Number 36684...
Chris S Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 The back of a early hollow back ...Number 15954....customized with a pin for ease of wear I imagine
Chris S Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 The front is customized as well with the H and S removed for a silver Lenin head...most strange...I paid no premium for this, bought it for its novelty value for around 20 dollars.Chris
Guest Rick Research Posted August 11, 2005 Posted August 11, 2005 Ah! VERY nice, thanks!!! Another set of variants to track down, between smooth reverses and mirror relief reverses.There should be about 110,000 of these in all, all types, out there... yet I doubt I see three a year show up over here. It's been years (years!) since the last time I saw a set of numbered badge with same numbered award booklet. They are very well made, which lets out breakage. The "Stalin" engine name is so small you need a magnifying glass to see it, which lets out tossed away for political reasons...so where are all these nice badges?????
Alfred Posted August 12, 2005 Posted August 12, 2005 (edited) Rick,one more date to complete the time-table.regardsAndreasNumber 5.282 - 16.01.1938silver type with two screwplates (sadly it?s not mine, I only have a picture) Edited August 12, 2005 by Alfred
Guest Rick Research Posted August 12, 2005 Posted August 12, 2005 Is that the full size silver version or the tiny one?
Alfred Posted August 12, 2005 Posted August 12, 2005 another date:number 106.771 - 29. May 1957 (perhaps 1951 - have only a bad picture collected a log time ago on the internet)brass badge type
Guest Rick Research Posted August 12, 2005 Posted August 12, 2005 Yes, the exact year would be very important. Lapin is quite vague about this, but it seems the badge with "Stalin" locomotive ceased being awarded-- possibly for decades-- before the later version (emerging from a tunnel, under a red "ribbon" suspension) came out. This is just "bugging" me, because there should certainly be over 100,000 of the "Stalin" locomotive types "out there" and yet these badges do NOT show up very often at all!!! As far as I can actually tell, the "suspension" version badge began to be awarded in 1978, though Igor Moiseyev listed one some years ago (no serial number in the description) with a booklet dated 1971. So it seems that NO badges were bestowed from about 1957 right into the 1970s...???
Chris S Posted August 12, 2005 Posted August 12, 2005 The modern version...they obviously awarded a lot...and yes, where have they gone...
Alfred Posted August 13, 2005 Posted August 13, 2005 (edited) An first attempt to classify the military railroad badges:1st version: small silver onebestowed 1. Oktober 1934 - possible charge 4.200lowest number observed: 1.748highest number observed: 4.177s/n 1 - 1. October 19342nd version (silver variant): large silver one (STALIN)bestowed 1935? - possible charge 8.000lowest number observed: 5.282highest number observed: 11.877s/n 5.282 - 16. January 1938s/n 6.251 - 12. October 19412nd version (brass variant): large brass one (STALIN)bestowed 1940? - possible charge 100.000lowest number observed: 12.422highest number observed: 111.591s/n 30.566 - "1944"s/n 40.477 - 2. October 1944s/n 66.580 - pre-March 1946 "NKPS" screw nuts/n 69.317 - 1946 but can't read date from tiny book, but "MPS" stamps/n 106.771 - 29. May 1957 (1957 likely 99%)Maybe they stopped to award the stalin version (2nd version) short after the secret speech of Chrustchow at the XX party congress at the end of 1956. To stop the personal cult around Stalin.3rd version : red suspensionbestowed ? - possible charge ?lowest number observed: 112.050 highest number observed: 135.164s/n 128.808 - 25. February 1974remarks to 3rd version: I think there are two variants: one with a more green and one with a more blue coloured enamel at the trolley--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Any other dates and comments are welcome! Edited August 13, 2005 by Alfred
Guest Rick Research Posted November 10, 2005 Posted November 10, 2005 More "in wear"-- Colonel Vladimir Nikolaevich Podozerov in 1947 at the Military Transportation Academy "in the name of L M Kaganovich"--Both his railways badges were awarded after 1940 (I have portraits of him 1935, 1937, 1940, 1947)
HuliganRS Posted November 10, 2005 Posted November 10, 2005 There are several factories that these were produced in. I've seen alot of variations. Although I don't collect them myself, they are stunning badges to look at.Rusty.
Guest Rick Research Posted November 12, 2005 Posted November 12, 2005 Hmmm... nothing on the congratulatory notification with the number of the badge-- but methinks I still see that little "Stalin" on the engine! Is this one you can put your paws on, or a scan of an item that is gone? I'm wondering about the number.THIS badge is very definitely bronze (and some gilt details) and not something that the silver has evaporated off of.
NavyFCO Posted November 13, 2005 Posted November 13, 2005 Here's a bigger version of the same. I KNOW I've got a pic of the badge around here somewhere!!!! Dave
NavyFCO Posted November 13, 2005 Posted November 13, 2005 In case you can't make it out, there is a "Stalin" on the front of the locomotive. The smaller badge belonged to the same fellow. Here are the reverses...
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