Paul C Posted July 16, 2006 Share Posted July 16, 2006 If you went to the July 15 Theis auction and know the high bid for item number 24 and 105 could you please post them. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeheld Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Hello,I was on the Thies auction. Lot 24 3600,- ? and Lot 105 350,-?.I believe the winner of Lot 24 was on the telephon.Lot 105 was Mr. Freihofer from the U.S.A.. But he told me, that he takes this Medalbar for an other collector from the U.S.A.best regardsSeeheldPlease excuse me terrible english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul C Posted July 17, 2006 Author Share Posted July 17, 2006 Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Eagle Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 http://www.andreas-thies.de/ergebnis_pdf/3...on_15.07.06.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolf Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 http://www.andreas-thies.de/ergebnis_pdf/3...on_15.07.06.pdfAnyone knows what was item 48? 61.000 EUR !!! Wow!Dolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul C Posted July 19, 2006 Author Share Posted July 19, 2006 Nr 48 is a red eagle orden chain to Abbas Hilma II VizeKing of Egypt. It is a beautiful piece made by Wagner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 no. 48! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 the cross... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolf Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 (edited) Thanks a lot Claudio.Very nice piece indeed! But 61.000 EUR!?! (More than 76.000USD)Sorry for my ignorance on this field, but is this a unique piece, or extremely, extremely rare, kind of only no more than three to five ever made?No diamonds on it, right? What is it made of? Gold, silver, enamel?Thanks again,Dolf Edited July 19, 2006 by Dolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Hi Dolf,First of all types of "Ordensketten" manufactured pre-1918 are extremely rare. The conditions of this particular one (in Gold) is excellent and it comes not only with the original case of issue but the original owner is known! Such things are unique... the price is only matter of how many are interested in it and bidding on it! Now we know... there are quite a lot of wealthy collectors interested in such Ordensketten... that drives also the prices up!Ciao,ClaudioThanks a lot Claudio.Very nice piece indeed! But 61.000 EUR!?! (More than 76.000USD)Sorry for my ignorance on this field, but is this a unique piece, or extremely, extremely rare, kind of only no more than three to five ever made?No diamonds on it, right? What is it made of? Gold, silver, enamel?Thanks again,Dolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 To add to what I just wrote, it would be advisable to read the interesting description made by Herr Thies. There is a story behind the bestowal of this ordenskette to the vice king of Egypt Abbas Hilma II, with very intersting political aspects.Only three of such Ordensketten are known to be owned by collectors: two of them made of Gold and the third silver gilted. This one was purchased by Mr. Seymour at the beginning of the 90ies for 29'000.- British Pounds (plus fees) at a well known auction house (Christie's)... see the text below: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medalnet Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 The hanovarian knight badge by Zell with swords topped everything off in my mind. 8.300 Euro plus 27%?!Goodness.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Yeah, I saw that too Andreas (Art. Nr. 32)! From 1'500.- to 8'300.- Euros!! I was tempted to bid on it, but fortunately I didn't... Did you purchase something nice, if I might ask you?Historical background to the bestowal of this Ordenskette: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul C Posted July 19, 2006 Author Share Posted July 19, 2006 Did anyone win any of the medal bar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Guelphen Orden, Ritterkreuz 1. Klasse mit Schwertern (milit?rische Division). Wow... I was lucky with a couple of bars, but first still need to wait for the invoice to come.Ciao,Claudio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 (edited) I got this one... I would love to know more about Major Rheinbaben!!!! I saw it in Illingen, one month before the auction; it is really in beautiful conditions with an old (1895-1905?) Godet's label on the back. Very nice... Edited July 19, 2006 by Claudio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 I got this one... I would love to know more about Major Rheinbaben!!!! I saw it in Illingen, one month before the auction; it is really in beautiful conditions with an old (1895-1905?) Godet's label on the back. Very nice... Hi Claudio,If I had gone after one more item, it would have been this one. I am very glad that you got it, congratulations. Wild Card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 (edited) The hanovarian knight badge by Zell with swords topped everything off in my mind. 8.300 Euro plus 27%?!Goodness....It was truly bizarre! The bidding went over to several, and ultimately two, telephone bidders. By the time it was over, virtually everyone in the room was laughing. I collected this order for 20 years and I can not figure this out - no I was not interested in this piece. An interesting footnote is that the Guelph collar, with badge went for 13500, a relative bargain; but, in my opinion, just about (maybe even a little low) right. Edited July 19, 2006 by Wild Card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Thanks Wild Card! Yeah! I noticed the Ordenskette of the Guelphen Orden; if you compare the price with the other Prussian Ordenskette, you can say that some of these prices are driven by emotions and collectors' greed ("I have to have it" or "I still miss it in my collection" kind of syndrome). Ciao,Claudio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Gentlemen,While we?re on the subject - can someone please explain lot #47 to me? $25,000 for a French copy? There has to be more to the story.Thank you,Wild Card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudio Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 I am by far not a specialist on these breast stars, but if I want to spend that kind of money, it better be an 100% provience proved piece made by an official German jeweller. On the other hand, since these were worn by European nobility who shared common ancestors and lineage, I guess that many of these orders were made also outside Germany, especially the special version such as with the "bandeau" Honi soit qui mal y pense.Ciao,Claudio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Card Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 I agree, don?t forget that genuine standard issue Black Eagle stars without the bandeau currently sell for about 8000 Euro. I think that I can give you an actual example of what we are dealing with here though.Arthur Duke of Connaught was given the collar to the Black Eagle in 1872. His star was the standard German issue to which he had the Order of the Garter bandeau added. Unfortunately, this star no longer exists as it was destroyed as the result of a robbery several years ago. I have a photograph of it somewhere from Eric Ludvigsen?s archives that I can not locate at the moment. My point, and I think that this is close to what you are saying, is that pieces such as this, at best, fall into that controversial area of wearing copies. I might add that I know of another piece virtually identical to this one, but with a different pin and slightly smaller eagle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolf Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Hi Dolf,First of all types of "Ordensketten" manufactured pre-1918 are extremely rare. The conditions of this particular one (in Gold) is excellent and it comes not only with the original case of issue but the original owner is known! Such things are unique... the price is only matter of how many are interested in it and bidding on it! Now we know... there are quite a lot of wealthy collectors interested in such Ordensketten... that drives also the prices up!Ciao,ClaudioHi Claudio,Thanks a lot. It makes perfectly sense now.Dolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medalnet Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Claudio,after just have gotten back from China, I almost didn't pick up the phone that morning when Thies called for my phone bid on the Ludwig knight. I gave up at Euro 5000.-.So nothig for me this time, but I am still celebrating my win at Morton & Eden a few weeks back.Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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