utopis

Has anyone ever encountered a bejeweled Osmanieh order like that? I wonder about the imperfections on the golden border, visible on the reverse...

Not to forget the Topkapi palace which exhibit's the highest Ottoman and European orders in brilliants received by the sultans.

your wife bought that shell? Nice

Quite comical. €5000 for a set of oakleaves with swords - at that rate I'd take a whole bunch. The comments are even funnier, declaring that collecting orders and medals is dead and soon everything will become worthless.

Yes all grades with swords are extremely rare. For example the third class was awarded 18 times while the 2nd class (neck badge + star) was awarded 25 times. So no more then 43 neck crosses were given out.

Yes, but these are extremely rare. There was even a collar badge with swords.

Very beautiful. Schatzkammer München, I assume?

Must have overlooked this topic. Anyways - is this your piece?

Both. Some marked, some unmarked. The overall quality gives this one away.

...

They were probably numbered continuously during production, I meant the numbers were awarded randomly

Statement retracted. Hm, maybe the numbering was completely random.

To be honest, I don't think that there are any others. Number 2162, I think. Who knows who took the decision to start with such high numbers...

Ultra rare first type, awarded in 1943 - we should have a thread on all the first types which often look quite strange

It would be interesting to know whether they were given out in order of numbering. Probably not - we know that 10XX are the earliest Thanks for the link. You're right these are different. Well we should still keep an eye on them

well it was new to me and obviously to bene merenti, too http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/13009245_serbia-st-sava-order-2-model-1903-1945-for-n

Some time ago this, so called St. Sava for non Christians was offered for sale on auction at a staggering starting price of 9000€, accompanied by the following description: "Serbia - St. Sava Order 2. model (1903-1945) for Non-christians Grandofficers Set. 1.) Cross: Silver partially gilded and enamelled multiple parts and open work on movable crown on decorated neck ribbon ring with likly incorrect neck ribbon 2.) Star: Body silver diamond cut multiple parts device partially gilded and enamelled open work device reverse twice screwed on on pin.#88 x 52 mm / 93 x 89 mm325 g / 862 g.##Contrary to the regular decorations the following differences are obvious - the breast shields of the double-head-eagles in the corners of the arms are removed as well as the dedication in the medallion wreath St. Sava from the medallion was replaced by the Iron Crown of the Lombardy. The changes where made in juweleres quality and before the decoration itself was assembled. #The Order was given for various merits in the civil sector as well for merits in the field of Religion. Like in Russia - wehre there are decorations for Non-christians - in the christian-orthodoy-muslim Serbia they did same with the Order that was named after a christian Saint. Saint Sava as well as the medallion circumscription dedicated to him that can easily be viewed as christian representatives where replaced by the Iron Crown of Lombardy. The crown is an ancient symbole of crowning - it should originate from the 5. Century and was first posessed by the Ostrogoths King Theoderich and was used for crowning first time by Konrad III. Many more crownings should follow. Therfor its a simbole showing the legitimacy of the serbian royal dignity which made an award to a Non-christian then also possible. Of greates rarity." Never having heard of a piece like that I was quite skeptical at first. And it didn't get better from there on. Having spoken to our dear member paja, he confirmed my concerns. So what's the idea behind this piece? Since Sava is a Christian saint, an award bearing his depiction would be unfit for a recipient believing in a different religion. So far the story but is it likely that these pieces were awarded? I don't think so. First of all why has no other piece been seen or even mentioned in the corresponding literature? Surely there was more than one award to non Christians. What about the Japanese medal bars we have seen with St Savas? - All of them were standard issues. What about the Crown of Lombardy? How has that anything to do with Serbia? I think the logic was supposed to be that the iron crown was the first insignia of Christendom, which also wouldn't be fitting for non Christians. Another thing: The star base appears to be Huegenin made (so post WWI)- why would anyone consider the sign of an enemy state (formerly part of the Austrian Order of the Iron Crown) as a fit? Why not just follow the Russian example and put the double headed eagle at the center? This looks to me like an authentic order that has been doctored just to make some extra bucks.

Exactly what I was thinking. National Liberation was similarly often awarded as the War Banner but you almost never see them. I only know of one War Banner publicly sold during the last three years (sadly I didn't get it - wasn't really a good deal, though). Hoard of unawarded ones is always an option but I think the best way would be to collect all images of them to see if some numbers appear twice on different pieces (=obvious sign). Thinking about it, I can scarcely remember that there was a story floating around about them. It was either something about the official dies of these being sold or that a bunch of produced but not awarded pieces were taken/sold from stock in the '90 (?)

Considering the condition it was definitely overpriced. I'm surprised no one picked up on the three large holes. I would think that these were once rivets but 3 is quite the unusual number for rivets (usually 4 or 2) and the holes are relatively asymmetrical.

What are you planing to clean? The best way to clean patinated silver is to do nothing at all and not ruin the piece. Best for light corrosion is to take an old tooth brush and brush the piece until it's gone.

dark379, check your private messages

Exactly what I thought, too

Probably a doctored 3rd class.

That's a collar without the chain

I remember, though it seems, I haven't taken your advice serious enough - still a nice pic