Claudio

This is the photo from Beyreiss book showing v. d. Hellen with von Hindenburg in 1927 during the inauguration of a monument in Oldenburg... That was surely the bar he wore before adding the Ehrenkreuz für Frontkämpfer...

Thanks my friends... Yes it's quite a wonderful medal bar and although it's not a Godet, it comes with a nice dealer's label of Hannover, which is known to me... much rarer to find than a Godet! ;)

Dear forumites! I'm proud to present to you a spectacular Oldenburg medal bar of Hauptmann von der Hellen, personal Adjutant of GFM von Hindenburg (there's a small picture of him on Beyreiss book about Oldenburg's orders and medals, wearing his medal bar). Here's the description of his decorations: Preussen: eisernes Kreuz 2. Klasse, 1914; Preussen: RK des Königlichen Hausordens von Hohenzollern mit Schwertern (ritzmarke „s & W”, silberstempel und „937“); Oldenburg: RK 2. Klasse des Haus- und Verdienstordens von Herzog Peter Friedrich Ludwig mit Krone und Schwertern; Oldenburg: Friedrich-August-Kreuz 2. Klasse mit Bandspange „vor dem Feinde”; Bayern: Militär-Verdienstorden 4. Klasse mit Schwertern; Sachsen: RK 1. Klasse des Albrecht-Ordens mit Schwertern (Stempel „s”); Braunschweig: Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2. Klasse; Lippe-Detmold: Kriegsverdienstkreuz am Kämpferband; 3. Reich: Ehrenkreuz für Frontkämpfer; Preussen: Kronen-Orden 4. Klasse; Preussen: DA-Kreuz für 25 Dienstjahre der Offiziere; Oldenburg: RK 2. Klasse des Haus- und Verdienstordens von Herzog Peter friedrich Ludwig. Unfortunately I couldn't find anything about his career. Would be somebody here on this very forum so kind to share a bit of information about this "obscure" officer and his career? Indeed being close to such a military personality like v. Hindenburg did influence a lot the fact that he got so many orders, very likely without ever seen the frontline as a Staff Officer. Thanks you very much in advance for looking into this thread and for your most appreciated comments on it. ciao, Claudio

Strange... Saint Anna Order should have red enamels (see http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_St._Anna) ... Maybe on black & white pictures it seems white but in reality it's red, like some yellow ribbons on b&w pictures look very dark...

The inscription (engraving) looks newer as the medal... no patina around or in the inscription... Turkish written in arabic letters is quite hard to decipher, because very few use it today (since Atatürk, it is used latin alphabet), but it would be nice to see what can be read and if it's free of possible orthographic mistakes... I'm a bit skeptical, but it's just me! ciao, Claudio

Please show the back of the bar... if it's covered with dark blue or black textile piece, then it could be very well Kriegsmarine... ;-)

I wish... I Don't have 350000 euro to spend for one group... Even though it's of historical importance like this one... ;)

Hii Paul, He didn't wear them on the medal bar because very likely wore them around the neck... (Higher classes of the Olympia-Ehrenzeichen, SEHO komturkreuz with swords and Volkspflege-Ehrenzeichen)... ;)

Hi Paul! I would be interested! ;-) Of course ideally would be to add some newly adquired information or colour pictures, but I guess that would dramatically increase the work to be put into it, and that without any financial compensation, in order to keep the price low. ciao, Claudio

Dear forumites, I want to show a Godet bar of a personality; GFM Erhard Milch (the whole group - documents, papers, 2 Doppelabzeichen with Brilliants, ribbon and medal bar, was for sale on HH catalogue a couple of years back, for mere Eur 350'000.- + commission.... not surprisingly it didn't sell, although the historical value IMHO could have been higher than the price asked). Look at the the details also on the double-row ribbon bar... I'm sure also quite typical Godet manufacture! ;-) Enjoy. ciao, Claudio

I looove these bars with the Finnish Freiheitskreuz and that class, it's even rarer.... I want it! ;-) Great group would that be, if it was still all together.... :-( C

I don't know you guys, but when I re-read Rick's educated comments, full of wit and good humour, I get very sad, thinking that he's no more among us.... ((((

Interesting questions, but even more is to know if that very bar survived WW2 and post war.... Maybe it lies still within his family (see also http://studiengruppe.blogspot.ru/2011/12/hanno-von-kemnitz-der-sohn-mathilde.html )

Great bar, Tilo! You get all the most interesting ones, you lucky dog... Seriously the Order of the Wendish Crown on a bar is very seldom seen. Beautiful... what else to say?

Thanks a lot for researching it! That's great... I knew that he likely hasn't got anything to do with anti-partisan/commissar/jewish actions on the Eastern Front... old school kind of professional officer... and Ritter! :-) ciao, C

Dear Forumites, Since you should be in this form quite educated in this matter, and because I am visiting Bucarest this weekend I was wondering if there are any interesting sites or museums to be visited where I can find nice orders or military uniforms? I would be very interested. Thanks in advance for your most precious inputs... it's very much appreciated! ciao, Claudio

Thanks Bernhard, I think the photo is even older than that... For sure it was taken well before 1939, very likely between 1934-36. In fact he is wearing a medal bar not on a Waffenrock, but on a Reichswehr style tunic. Furthermore I don't remember to have spotted a Hindenburg cross on it (FEK), but I might be wrong, and the 4th decoration I'm pretty sure is the Chilean merit order (1 EK, 2 BMVO 4x, 3?, 4 Chile NVO, 5?). Since there weren't soo many MMVO wearer and the combination is quite unique, I think it might quite easy to find for the wizard researchers on this forum... ;-)

Dear forumites, I found this interesting pictures of a senior officer wearing his medal bar and the MMVO at his 2nd tunic's button hole... Can be identified? There was no description of this officer in the museum... what I found interesting and quite strange that this officer's photo was placed in a room where there were exposed memorabilia about the holocaust and the nazi racial policy in the occupied Ukraine... Maybe this officer hasn't anything to do with it... they could have just put it there because it look so nice and so German "nazi" looking... However I could be wrong. It would be nice to be educated on this... :-) Thanks in advance for all your most appreciated inputs! ciao, C

maybe a Mecklenburg-Strelitz unit or a Prussian unit connected to Mecklenburg? http://www.ehrenzeichen-orden.de/deutsche-staaten/kreuz-fur-auszeichnung-im-kriege-1-klasse.html

Superb group... I like especially the Bulgarian green order, which is also so beautifully confirmed of the photo and the ZVO1Kl... too bad that the medallion on the back is missing! :-(

Hi Chris, I will trying to put a value, but some of the medals on the bar are really rare, but some very common... it all depends also what an amateur and collector of non-combatant bars or specifically collecting orders and medals of a single miniature German state pre-1918 (like Schaumburg-Lippe) would be prepared to shell out to get such a bar. If you are the only one to want something like that, then it's going to be comparatively cheap, but if there're just 2 of you who really want this bar, in auction can get very easily out of hand and very emotional and impulsive. SM VK am Nichtkämpferband, I would say no more than 120 Euro, also if that non-combatant ribbon is really very rare... Ludwig-Kreuz... pretty common... Eur 40.- Hl. St. Michael Orden 4th class with crown... again also here some Bavarian collectors can get very emotional, normally I would pay 600-800 Euro for that non-official commemorative jubilee medal for monarchist... well no definite price on it, but with that nice and rare ribbon I'd say 50-60 Euro? Prinzregent Luitpold Medal... cheap... very common in Bavaria... Eur 40.- Anhalt Hönigbär ;-) 1st class... mmmhhh... there are undervalued... quite a lot of "post-war" pieces around... an original would surely fetch about 600-800 Eur... not so collectable, maybe because there are no enamels and it's not cross-shaped Schaumburg-Lippe order for arts and sciences first class... well there are really rare, especially on bars! it all boils down to demand and offer, but I would say 1000-1500 Euros? Total about Eur 3'000/3'500.- including 10% price increase because there is a name to it. Personally I would rather spend Eur 3000 then 3500, but it depends how much you want to have it in your collection. ciao, Claudio

aha... that's why I didn't buy it! ;-)

here it is...

… ich wurde in meiner Sammlerkarriere genug gestraft worden…

easy…. Hausorden der Rautenkrone – Bruststern http://www.ehrenzeichen-orden.de/deutsche-staaten/hausorden-der-rautenkrone-bruststern-vergl-oek-2068.html