Hauptmann

Hi all, I'm currently watching this and yet I'm wondering if the Labor medal is not a fake. According to the red bible if the "No" is not made as a part of the medal (which I take to mean raised, like the inscription, and not as it says stamped or engraved) then it's a fake. It seems to meet the other criteria... top of the star on the obverse touching the rim, and the ring being soldered on separately. But if what the red bible says still holds true on this one and I'm correct in how I'm reading it then I assume it's a fake. And by the way, the seller wrote back in answer to my questions (and to provide additional pics) and he thinks the "No" looks engraved. Now whether he misunderstood and thought I meant the actual serial numbers... I don't know for sure. But I don't think that's the case. And it's so difficult to tell in pics, even those used in the red bible exactly whether they are raised as I stated above or what. I do wish I'd had the opportunity to see and handle an original to be sure of all this, but failing that I'm putting out a plea for help! Also opinions... does it look like an original bar (albeit if the Labor is faked perhaps that was simply put in place of the original Labor in order to make it seem more valuable... not that I'm accusing the current seller of same... but that it could have been done in the past at some point), and what do you feel the value should be "if" the Labor is a fake (or, if I'm wrong and it's real)? I'm assuming I'd have to look at it as a sum of it's parts and that the only sure way to know if it's actually an original group would be research. But again just thought I'd pop this out for opinions. I don't have a ton to spend so no telling if it'll even go beyond that or what. I'm hoping if the Labor is confirmed to be fake that he'll not that in the auction and that might help. Here are some pics:

Hi Troy, Sorry I didn't get back sooner on this but many thanks to Fire Medals to giving the answer... especially since I didn't know. Some beautiful pieces you have. And welcome to the club by the way! Dan

Hi all, Here's another example I've had for ages: Dan

I just realized... this has the gold spacers between the ribbons that have been mentioned before. Very cool! Dan

This from a people/regime that blew up many of their ancient (and newer) churches, melted down the bells and destroyed God only knows what in their early communist campaigns against religion and the nobility/aristrocracy. And now they want to worry about things that they produced in their millions upon millions! I can totally understand awards or items that belonged to HSU's, famous individuals... things like that. But much of what they deem cultural... they're NUTS! It would be like our government suddenly worrying about where each and every Kennedy Half Dollar ever minted was and saying it's illegal to have them outside of the country! It would be insane! Granted... it's their country and they can do what they want. But they're not making any friends in doing it. You'd think they'd feel great about the idea that there are so many people around the world who are fascinated with and want to collect and study their history, especially that of the GPW. For so long they could care less, other than items from their highest leaders, etc. And here we've been trying to honor the memory of their long forgotten heroes... whether it was a lowly private who was awarded a Glory 3rd or a Marshal with a chest full of ODM's... it didn't matter to us. We spend our money (tons of it) to obtain and then research and learn all we can about people that their history has basically all but forgotten. And instead of a hearty thanks we get kicked in the rear! Lord knows... we don't do it for their government. We do it for the memory of those who fought and often gave their all. We do it for our love of history. Due to all their crimes against history they don't even know what much of their true history is anymore. Sorry... just had to vent a bit. Dan

Hi Charles, Another great find! I do love those numbered sets! And I really like the pin clasps on both pieces. Very nice how the one on the mini stickpin is flattened and curved out like that. A great set!!!! Congrats my friend! Here's to you finding many more before you head home! Dan

Hi all, Just spotted this and figured it might be of some interest: http://www.supertouchblog.com/2007/08/09/b...-of-the-turtle/ Dan

Hi all, Just spotted this and thought it might be of interest: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/kent/6953664.stm Dan

Hi all, If this is not the right place for this please feel free to move it. Hoping this might be of interest: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1557470/posts A few more to be sold... so if you have a bit of extra cash laying around and want the ultimate toy... I can pretty much guarantee you'll be the only one on your block to have one! Dan

Hi Alex, I do believe it is actually... Jack Angolia got it for me at a very good price many, many moons ago. It's been one of my prized pieces ever since. And it brings back very fond memories of several extremely pleasant visits to his home and museum. It's definitely a nice one to have. I believe there is one place that carries them but I can't for the life of me remember who it was, where or for how much... athough I believe it was a few hundred dollars. I found it on a google search at one point or another. If I find it again I'll be happy to pass the info along. I've seen the Third classes (the breast badge) for about $50 or thereabouts on Ebay on occassion. They come in red cases which are not anything like original German TR cases. The gold on them is way too shiney and if you compare it with my First class you'll definitely see how bad it looks by comparison. http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=11533 Sad thing is I was given the opportunity to buy a cased original by Jack way back when for $5,000. At the time I could have easily afforded it. But I just couldn't see having that much money tied up in a badge which would sit on a shelf in the den so I passed it up. In fact that's when he offered to find me a nice copy, hence the First class I have. But at times I wish I'd gotten the original as well... as Lord only knows what it would be worth now. Dan

I'm not positive but mine might be one of those Souval's: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=11532 No idea what they run now... but I remember when I saw my first one it was at a show in Ft. Lauderdale twenty some odd years ago and it was up for $800. Dan

Hoping to research it along with the rest... perhaps it'll end up being the jewel in the crown. One never knows. Dan

Hi all, Here's my newest which just arrived. A bit worse for the wear but I love it all the same, and the price was definitely right. I just couldn't pass it up. Sorry about the makers mark being slightly out of focus but it was the best I could do on my scanner.

Hey, I think you did an excellent job. Had that one not shifted just slightly... and even then considering. To do some of my things I've really had to get into some strange positions, holdings things, with other things keeping the lid of the scanner slightly elevated and then having to reach across to type in the proper dimensions for the final scan. And then having to do it several times. But then the end result is generally always worth it. But these are so much nicer than the small types that I've seen issued by many of the Warsaw Pact countries. More decorative like many of the TR docs I've seen. I especially love the large representations of the awards. So just how hard it is to find Yugoslavian awards with docs and does that move the price way up? I've yet to see any on Ebay which is my primary source unless something pops up in the club. Dan

Hi Kevin, Sure... if you own an old car you drive it... if you own an old pocket watch you use it (or should)... if you own beer steins... Dan

Hi Ed, Geez... okay, now I have to find documented awards because I LOVE those docs!!!! Yet more things to add to the list. Thanks for sharing... they are beautiful! Dan

Dan

Hi all, Don't know for sure if this fits... and it's been posted before here: http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1632...rian+fire+cross but figured I'd pop it in just in case.

All pics from the auction. If anyone object I'll be happy to remove them. But seems all too often items from auctions are listed with just the auction link and once it's over and removed from their system it's lost for reference. So figured this was the best way to preserve it. Dan

Original NY Times article:

Hi all, To save it here for posterity: Description from Auction: This vase was owned by Catherine the Great, smashed by Napoleon, restored, brought to America -- and that's just the beginning of the story. History and Provenance: The story in the April 8, 1927 New York Times (and elsewhere) runs like this-- This legendary vase's original owner was Catherine the Great, who later gave it to Louis de Cobenzel, a renowned Austrian diplomat. While Cobenzel was conducting peace-treaty negotiations at Camp Formo with Napoleon (then a general), Cobenzel intimated that he was considering enlisting Russian aid. Napoleon was furious and declared, "The truce is now ended and war is declared--but beware! Before autumn is over, I shall shatter your empire like I shatter this vase." And with that, Napoleon picked up the vase and smashed it in the fireplace." Fortunately, Napoleon's brother Joseph was also at the conference. According to the report, Joseph gathered the pieces and had the vase restored. After Napoleon's fall from power, Joseph brought the vase to America where he later gave it to a friend, Adam David Logan. Mr. Logan gave the vase to Miss Mary B. Alburtis, a young New York society woman to whom he was betrothed. However, Mr. Logan died before their wedding day and Miss Alburtis kept the vase in his memory until she bequeathed it to Dr. Martha Huson, her physician. Dr. Huson later borrowed $3000 from a nurse, Miss Margaret Conway. Dr. Huson pledged the vase as collateral for the loan, which she was unable to repay. Yet, Dr. Huson did not want to turn the vase over. She estimated its value as $150,000 ($1,796,137 in today's dollars). However, a judgment was issued against Dr. Huson, and the vase was set to be sold at auction to pay off the debt. Apparently the auction never happened. The article concludes by reporting that possession of the vase had been transferred to Miss Conway. Current owners of the vase are relatives of a friend of Miss Conway to whom she eventually gave the vase. Description of Vase: The vase features a richly painted portrait believed to be that of Catherine II of Russia. Its base has a dark-red, inverted 'N' surmounted by five stars. The damages to the vase brought on by Napoleon's temper tantrum have been repaired, and the vase is again fully intact. Interestingly, the cracks help to authenticate the vase?they exactly match the cracks pictured in the New York Times article. There is significant corrosion and peeling inside the mouth of the vase. Furthermore, the nut and bolt to attach the base is corroded. The base can be reattached to the vase itself: there is an opening in the bottom of the vase that is the right size to accommodate the bolt. Yet, insofar as the condition of this vase is the highlight of its story, we are leaving all assembly and restoration decisions to the buyer. The vase's dimensions are as follows: Height (vase only) 13 1/2" Height (inc. base) 16 1/2" Width mouth 5" Width widest part 10" Alternative Version of the Story: Here's another version of the story taken from John Holland Rose's The Life of Napoleon I (1912). It gives a different picture of how the vase came to be shattered. Regardless of the historical interpretation, it is clear that the vase's fate was the direct result of Napoleon's hot temper. "...On the fate of these islands a stormy discussion arose, Cobenzl stipulating for their complete independence, while Bonaparte passionately claimed them for France. In one of these sallies his vehement gestures overturned a cabinet with a costly vase: but the story that he smashed the vase, as a sign of his power to crush the house of Austria is a later refinement on the incident, about which Cobenzl merely reported to Vienna -- "He behaved like a fool."

Hi all, I just spotted this on Ebay and thought it might be of interest: http://cgi.ebay.com/Antique-Vase-Smashed-b...1QQcmdZViewItem Dan

Hi Vic, Oooooh... more goodies! I can't wait!!!! Many thanks my friend!!!! Dan